Denver Hawk

Hello Everyone, I am a long time reader of this forum but have never posted before now. I am having a problem that I can't quite figure out so I am turning to you fine folks for ideas. I have a 99 Hawk with 55k miles on it. I just installed a new Barnett clutch and springs. I got everything put back together and had no resistance at the clutch lever. After bleeding at both the slave bleed valve and the banjo bolt on the MC. I have firm resistance in the clutch lever and no problems shifting into gear. My issue is that the bike will go down the road fine at small throttle openings but as soon as I try to accelerate the clutch starts slipping. I've bled the clutch system several additional times and I am still having the same problem.

Have I failed to get all of the air out of the system or is there something else that could be causing this?

8541Hawk

What kind of oil are you running as those clutch plates don't like synthetic oils.

Did you soak the plates in oil before you installed them.

If not those two, then check for air in the clutch system.

CrankenFine

If you removed your clutch lever from the master cylinder at any point in the process then make sure the pin from the master cylinder piston is fully seated in the round brass pivot in the lever. (don't ask me how I know this...)

Denver Hawk

I did soak the clutch plates in oil and just did an oil change after the clutch replacement with Mobil 1 4T 10W-40. I'll try changing over to conventional oil and see if that helps.

I haven't removed the clutch lever but I will remember that tip if I ever do.

Wolverine

Shouldn't need to. I've used that oil forever, it's moto specific and designed to work in wet clutches.

Did you replace just the fibers or the metals too? If your stack is too thin (worn metal plates) it could cause the slippage you are experiencing.

Denver Hawk

I installed a complete clutch kit that included fiber discs, metal discs, and springs. The only thing it didn't include was a new clutch plate spring and spring seat. Those are the two very thin metal rings that sit behind the clutch plates.

scottiemann

Im assuming you reinstalled those, or bought new OEM ones...

8541Hawk

Have you ever seen a Barrnett or EBC replacement clutch plates?

EBC states that their clutches will not work with syn oil.

While Barrnett claims there stuff will work they also say don't switch from std to syn oil after you have some wear.

So while the oil could be ok again I will stick with what I have seen which is some aftermarket clutch plate don't like syn oil, no matter what the bottles says and it could be causing an issue.

I'll just stick with the stock plates, that is if they ever need changing.....still have the original plates in mine

Wolverine

Why, yes I have. Replaced OE w/ them before and didn't have any issues to speak of, always used full syn too.


Taken directly from the Barnett website: barnettclutches.com/service_center
That being said, I personally wouldn't dump fresh M1 in this instance. YMMV

Denver Hawk

Thanks for all the input so far. I changed the oil to conventional Valvoline 10-40 motorcycle specific oil with no impact. I re-bled the clutch system a couple dozen times using every trick I could find by searching this forum again with no change. The clutch still slips with any decent size throttle opening. I was doing 30 MPH at 7K RPM in second gear.

Any other thoughts on what I may have done wrong when I installed the clutch? I am close to admitting defeat and taking it to a professional to clean up my mess.

Thanks

thetophatflash

I would take off the clutch cover and look for something obstructing full engagement of the plates. Debris or breakage, a piece of a shop towel? Time to go back in Doctor.

CruxGNZ

I agree with thetophatflash. You have done everything you can without pulling the engine cover off.

Look at chapter 9-12 in the manual. Make sure your clutch assembly looks like the picture below.

franz125

The only thing it didn't include was a new clutch plate spring and spring seat. Those are the two very thin metal rings that sit behind the clutch plates.
That is the probleem Put them back like Picture shows-judder spring and spring seat.

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kenmoore

I had a similar problem when I removed the clutch whilst doing a whole lot to my engine .

Turns out I had reassembled the clutch plates wrong.

Download a manual if you don't have one and follow the instructions precisely.

Good luck!

Painful I know from first hand experience.

Denver Hawk

Thank you everybody for the help so far.

It appears that I messed up and had the last two friction plates lined up in the shallow notch at the end of the clutch center instead of just one plate. After re-assembling the clutch discs and plates it appears things are working properly. I will post a final resolution tomorrow after I have a chance to give it a more extended test ride.

CruxGNZ

I installed mine according to the picture and have had zero problems.

thetophatflash

After working in tool and equipment repair for almost 25 years, I learned that if it didn't work as expected after the proper procedure and parts , I was probably responsible. The ability to question all facets of a repair, including your hands-on contribution can be invaluable in the post repair world of "why don't it work, I fixed it?"

Tweety

Well... It pains me to admit it... But like thetophatflash said... 9 times out of 10 when things didn't work as expected when I'm wrenching, suppressed and highly classified evidence points to a single culprit... And it ain't the nut holding things in place that gets the blame, but the one holding the tools...

Denver Hawk

I can now verify that the problem with my clutch install was all my fault. Everything is working perfectly now that I have installed the plates in the correct spot.

Jayde DuFresne

Hello, may I ask a question somewhat related? I'm new to the forum. My clutch was acting funny, so I pulled the slave cover off and replaced the paper gasket. We bled it, and it is not engaging whatsoever. I cannot start it without jumping it, and I cannot shift it without it slamming into first. Any help would be greatly appreciated :-)

Meier Link

Bleed the system again.

My experience is if you are only using the stock bleed port at the slave then it can and will be a pain in the ***. I recommend either adding a secondary bleed at the master or use a vacuum bleeder at the slave to ensure a proper bleed.

The arc coming off the master makes it hard to bleed the system properly if you are using the bottle method.