wizzardofboz

My '02 died while I was cruising on the highway, it felt like I had accidentally hit the engine kill switch (I had not). It turns over fine and there is gas to the carbs, it just doesn't start. Not even a stumble. Pulled a plug and turned it over and there is no spark.

I'm going to check the kick stand switch and the wires running to the engine kill switch, just in case its something simple.

After some research it seems like it may be the ignition converter module, How would I go about testing this?

Any other ideas?

(before it cut out on me it was running great)

oahu hawk

Classic regulator/rectifier...

twinman

I thought they upgraded them in 02

JKnight5

Was the bike doing anything wierd before this happened? Ex: lights dimming, turn signals delayed, or guages going out.

smokinjoe73

Kinda sounds more like the main fuse. RR is usually sorta gradual. The battery is low but not at zero, stuff starts going haywire first.

Check the main fuse. There is no way to test a black box other than replacing with a known working unit, and even that is putting the replacement at risk.

Tweety

And, sorry to single you out... But, please, stop spreading false information... Do your homework on R/R's or say nothing... The forum is filled with people parroting bad info...

No, they didn't "upgrade" them... They added thermal mass in the form of fins, making it overheat more slowly...

The components inside are exactly the same, and they have a limited lifespan, roughly 5 years (as the manufacturers for the individial components rate them)... Ie for an 06, which is the "newest" manufactured VTR, that time limit has expired...

wizzardofboz

The fuse for the gauges blew that morning, but I had been moving the controls around to test clearance for superbike bars, so i chalked it up shorting something if accidentally tugged on some wires too hard. All the other fuses in the fusebox under the seat are good, I the main fuse in another location?

All other electrics work fine, starter, headlights, gauges, horn, just wont start.

I'm an '02 w/20k, so my R/R could probably stand to be replaced, though I have not experienced any charging issues.

Tweety

Yes, the main fuse is in another location, by the starter relay, left hand side under the rear plastics... But with all the other stuff working, it's good, since it cuts power to the entire bike when it's gone...

With those symptoms, start looking for damaged wires in the things you pulled on...

smokinjoe73

Yeah, I misunderstood that everything electrical was nonfuntional.

If everything else works, focus on kill switch, starter wire connections, sidestand switch, etc. Are you trying to start it in gear? Put it in neutral so you can discover its your clutch lever sensor. (2 plugs that tell bike clutch is pulled in under the perch)

wizzardofboz

I was starting in Neutral, clutch in kickstand up (as well as numerous other combinations). I will start checking out wiring and test the kill switches to make sure they are working properly.

Would the ignition module/ converter going out cause such a sudden cut, or a more gradual death like a R/R going bad (or so I've heard)?

smokinjoe73

The icm could act any way it wants. Mine tweaked after I drilled right into the wiring harnes (dont judge). But only the tach went out after repairs.

Tweety

The R/R can take out the ICM and ECU in an instant... *poof* and magic smoke, if it fails by bypassing one leg of the R/R and puts 30 volts into the system... Or they could gradually die from the R/R being bad and feeding 15V+, or from something else entirely, usually corrosion or similar causing a short or excessive heat...

Short answer, none of your symptoms rule out either the ECU, the CDI, or the R/R as of now... You need more info to tell... And for that, you need to take out the multimeter and start measuring things... Until you do that, and give us some numbers to work with, we are all just guessing...

wizzardofboz

Thanks for the help, I wanted to get together a list of things to check so when I got time to start troubleshooting I had something to go on. I'll post when I figure something out/ have more data.

GIVER-A-TWIST

MINE JUST DID THE SAME THING LAST NIGHT.... I PULLED SPARK PLUGS OUT AND IM NOT GETTING ANY SPARK BUT ALL OTHER LIGHTS TURNS SIGNALS WORK FINE. ALL FUSES ARE GOOD SO MY QUESTION IS, WHAT PART SPECIFICALLY SUPPLIES SPARK TO PLUGS?

smokinjoe73

hey giver, it kinda seems like your shouting. you know the all caps thing. I print in all caps when handwriting but on here its alarming.

The coils supply spark to the plugs.

Did you check your kill switch? Sidestand switch? Clutch switch? Those could do it. Unlikely both coils went all at once at the same time. What is battery voltage?

GIVER-A-TWIST

sorry about the caps lock im at work and everything i do is in caps and just forgot to turn it off..

i'm getting 12 volts to R/R and all fuses are good.
checked side stand switch and its good.
checked kill switch and its good.
haven't tried clutch switch yet....but its in neutral and with kickstand up or down it wont start.
everything else works ... could it be my stator?

GIVER-A-TWIST

checked clutch switch its good

smokinjoe73

Stators fail very rarely. Shops LOVE to replace them cuz no one ever know whats going on in there. Stator is just one magnet moving past a bunch of others with no contact, so when theres contact it is pretty loud.

What happens when you try to start it. Click, turn over does the dash dim? Be sure your battery connections are perfectly clean and tight. Same goes for ground from RR. 12 volts is kinda low for voltage but hard to tell what led up to this.

VTRumble

Mine died on the way home from Laconia last month. First sign was no speedo, tach, or lights. Pulled the plug off the r/r and it was partially melted. Ended up scraping and squeezing the terminals the best I could, reversing the leads on my battery tender plug and hooking it up to a friend's bike (we were on the side of et. 93 in NH) until his bike started to get hot. It started right up and made it 2 hours home no prob. I bought a plug and conn. from eastern beaver to replace it. Even hooked up after a few min. it had lights but wouldn't crank, may want to try and charge it some if its not cranking. I just remembered that without the headlight fuse in it wouldn't crank either.

wizzardofboz

After some probulating:
Kill switch: good
kickstand switch: good
TPS: good
Pulse generator: pulsing (no peak voltage adapter)

The R/R is in good physical shape, no melting or discoloration
I did the R/R tests in the shop manual, though they are just be on the harness.
ground good, power good, the charging coils were reading .5-.7 ohm instead of .2-.5, it is hotter than the 68 degrees stated in the manual if that makes a difference?

So now I'm looking at: Ignition Coils, Ignition Control Module, Ignition Converter.

I doubt that both ignition coils died at exactly the same time (could be wrong)

It seems from a little research that the converter is more likley to go bad than the ICM?

any thoughts? I'm looking for a converter on ebay.

wizzardofboz

I tried to fire the coils manually as suggested in this post:

https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...41/#post252416

and it did not work. However I'm getting .9ohm on the primary coil and ~20k on the secondary.

Correction: both are reading .9 ohms for the primary, the rear is reading 19.8k and the front is reading 24.6k. This is measured between the connector at the Ignition Converter and the spark plug wire.

Both ICM and the converter modules have good spark and good ground.

7moore7

Where are you located?

wizzardofboz

Bethesda, MD.
I Don't have a Direct Voltage Adapter, but using a normal multimeter, the voltage on the pulse generator while cranking is peaking at .35v. It is supposed to be .7v, I'm not sure if this is a symptom of not using the right tool or if I just found my problem. (I read somewhere that you can usually get a peak reading with a modern digital multimeter without the adapter, but I did read that on the internet...)

The weather just got super nice for the weekend to taunt me...

GIVER-A-TWIST

FIXED!!! I replaced my cdi and still nothing so i replaced the igniter box and problem solved

wizzardofboz

What do you mean by CDI? I've been going off this diagram:

http://binatani.com/wp-content/uploa...ic-system1.jpg

By Igniter do you mean the Converter Unit?

wizzardofboz

I ordered a Converter off of ebay and threw it in last night, It fired right up.

wizzardofboz

I replaced the Converter and It fired right up. I also put in a MOSFET R/R for some added reliability.