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Bike died, no electrical power

Old 06-21-2005, 07:40 PM
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Bike died, no electrical power

I was riding home a few hours ago and all the sudden my bike quit. All my lights went out and it wouldnt do anything. I pulled the seat and rear fairing off and found that the fuse in the distribution panel (labeled "starter relay switch" in my manual) was blown. (this distribution panel comes straight from the positive battery cable) I put the spare in and it blew as soon as i plugged the small wiring harness back in the top of where the fuse goes. Anyone had similar problems? Any advice or suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated!

Thanks!

Edit: the wiring harness coming off the top of the relay switch behind the fuse with 4 smaller wires is corroded and so are the four prongs. I'm going to clean it and see what happens next.

I tested the switch assembly like it says in the manual. Says to connect the yellow/red terminal to pos. 12v and green/red to negative. But there is continuity between these to terminals (the two side by side closest to the fuse) so it trips out. Is there suppose to be continuity between these two? If there is I can't understand why the manual tells you to put 12v pos to one and negative to the other. I guess maybe this starter relay switch is bad?
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Old 06-22-2005, 07:48 AM
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I'm a little confused but it sounds like you are talking about the main fuse, on the left side under the rear cowl. Its a 30 amp spade fuse.

This fuse is inline between the positive terminal of the battery and the ignition swith, fusebox and regulator. It sometimes blows with a bad regulator or loose battery connection.

Pull out all the fuses from the fuse box, turn the key off and disconnect the regulator. Then put in a new main and see what happens. Add the regulator back first, then ignition switch to on, then the fuses. Add the fuses back (with the ignition on) one at a time until something blows. That's your problem circuit. You seem to have a short.

I'm betting on a bad regulator.

But do what I've said to narrow your search. And yes, you are on the right track to renovate any bad or loose connections.
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Old 06-22-2005, 08:32 AM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

I'm also betting on the regulator.

Almost the same thing have happen to me... twice I was running and sudden all turn off! I replaced the fuse, check all the wires harness, etc etc, to finally change the regulator for a used one from a CBR1100XX because I was thinking that like it's a bigger bike, maybe the regulator will be more strong. To bad this one have also fail some time after, I was very anger !!

So, do what jschmidt said and if you find that it's your regulator don't do the same mistake as me the first time, do NOT replace it with another stock one. Check the forum for rectifier/regulator mod, you will have many choice.

For my part, I've bought and install a 98 Yamaha R1 regulator, the VTR wire plug doesn't fit in it, you have to remove all the plastic and plug each single wire in the regulator. The R1 unit is also bigger, so you will have also to drill another hole in the aluminum plate holder but that's all.

Check all the mods, there's also another one who suggest to put a fan on the VTR stock rectifier that seem also to work. So do the mods you are most comfortable with but DO one of them, only after this you will get the peace of mind! This is frustrating and unpleasant to be stock in the side of the highway, I knew this two times!!

Good mods!
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Old 06-22-2005, 09:43 AM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

Thanks for the reply guys!

jschmidt, yeah it is the one on the left side under the rear cowl with the 30 amp fuse. I tested the 4 prong wiring harness that connects to it and the 2 wires on the frame side (red, and red/white) both have ~12V. But the 2 terminals they connect to on the relay are both grounds. So this must be why its popping the fuse. All of the fuses in the fuse box next to the battery are good and I coulddn't find any wires grounded. I will try what you suggested about taking all the fuses out.
Is the rectifier/regulator mounted on the right side of the frame? About a half inch thick and about 4 or 5 inches long? I noticed the right side of the frame was pretty warm right after the bike shut down. Anyone have a picture of what the rectifier/regulator looks like? What does it do?

Thanks again for the replys!
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Old 06-22-2005, 10:09 AM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

Yes, the regulator is on the right side of the sub frame assembly and just as you describe. It's also "normal" that the parts around there were warm after a ride, this regulator need to dissipate a lot of heat.

The basic function of this parts is to convert the three phases AC power current that goes out of the bike alternator into a single phase 12V DC current suitable for the bike electric system and it's this process that produce so many heat.

See pics and topic here:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/viewt...ight=regulator

And also here:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/viewt...ight=rectifier

And if you want more, see this site for the heatsink and fan modifications:
http://www.burniemorgan.com/firestorm/reg_heatsink.html

Hope this will help
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Old 06-22-2005, 12:15 PM
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Since you have the manual, follow the procedure to test the regulator.
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Old 06-22-2005, 12:31 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

Awesome! Thanks alot IceBud! I'm going to test the rectifier tonight and see what I can find on ebay to replace it.

Thanks again!
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Old 06-22-2005, 12:33 PM
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I'll also toss in another set of r/r links.

Fault finding r/r issues
http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/.../dead_reg.html

Replacing the r/r with a non-honda item
http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/...g_replace.html
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Old 06-22-2005, 01:52 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

Mithrandir have just put the finger on it! thx to have post, I have lost this link since I have done this mod.

This is exactly what I have follow on my second r/r failure and it work very well for me. Very simple and also very less expensive; the R1 r/r unit cost me about 40$ at my local bike scrapyard compare to the 110$ I have pay for the Blackbird unit and also compare to a brand new Honda r/r.

IMO the R1 r/r mod is much better than the heatsink+fan mod because the way the stock Honda r/r unit is done, it's the rear side of the unit (the side with the metal plate) that are intended to dissipate the heat by tranfering it to the bike rear frame assembly that will act as a giant heatsink, not the plastic side that we see. It's possible that this mod work, I'm not saying the opposite but in theory ( ahhh! theory ) this is not efficient to try to cool down the opposite side of the heat source.

For more, the R1 unit have also is own heatsink with some fin on the top, this is why I have perform the R1 mod instead of the heatsink+fan. But, this is my opinion only.

So now, mks8882, i think you are well equip to solve your problem.
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Old 06-22-2005, 03:38 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

I keep forgetting that I've never posted my GSXR R/R mod here but I did on the VFR site since I know how big a problem it is for that model too!
Scroll down the thread for the pics and a short how to:

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/i...opic=9687&st=0
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Old 06-23-2005, 06:19 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

I have an R1 r/r on the way, maybe this will keep me from having r/r trouble in the future.

Thanks again for all the info! I'll let you all know how things work out.
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Old 06-25-2005, 06:37 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

i also found this regulator on ebay
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Old 06-25-2005, 07:45 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

That price is close to the lowest price I can find on the net for the new stock item. My dealer would be closer to $200!.

If this ebay item is an electrotex design, they don't fare that much better. Nmerous failures on the VFR list over the years; however, that company did listen to complaints and tried to upgrade the design with mixed results.

YMMV.
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Old 06-26-2005, 06:11 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

I installed the R1 r/r today and so far so good. Seems to be charging properly and runs good! Thanks for all the help, this place is great!
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Old 06-29-2005, 05:07 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

just wanted to see if this sounded like a regulator problem. i was going to work and i looked down to see how fast i was going to notice my speedo and tach jumping around and my trip meter going in and out. my blinkers just kinda stutter and my horn hardly works i got home and checked the connections, but didn't find anything loose, took it for a quick ride to see if it would do it again but it didn't. about a half hour after i got home i tried to start the bike. wheni hit the starter every thing just died on the gauges. but if i moved my handlebars from left to right it will come back on until i hit the starter again.
please let me know asap. she's my only transportation and i have to go to work at 6 a.m. tomorrow

thanks
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Old 06-29-2005, 06:38 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

This doesn't sound like an r/r problem to me. The part where you say you move your handlebars and everything comes back on makes it sound like a short. You can unplug the r/r and if it's the culprit the bike should start up, but you wont have lights and the battery won't be charged.
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Old 06-29-2005, 09:42 PM
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Re: Bike died, no electrical power

Originally Posted by inderocker";p=&quot View Post
just wanted to see if this sounded like a regulator problem.
thanks
On the VFR list of which I've been on for 5+ years, a classic sign of R/R problems is the tach stopping, the clock resetting to 1:00, the engine stalling and then barely cranking. But if moving things improves matters, it might be an electrical short.

Voltmeters are NICE. I monitor mine more than I do the H20 temp.
https://www.superhawkforum.com/viewt...ight=voltmeter
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Old 06-29-2005, 10:52 PM
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That sounds much more like a bare wire somewhere. Moving the bars should not have an effect on the electrical system!
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Old 06-30-2005, 12:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Mithrandir";p=&quot View Post
That sounds much more like a bare wire somewhere. Moving the bars should not have an effect on the electrical system!

after moving the bars and having it cut out, i jiggled all the wires in that area and did not have the same response. hmmmm? i then tore the bike down and went through all of the wiring and could not find a single bare wire or burnt connection. as a last and almost idiotic measure i checked the battery terminals. the negative side was very tight but the positive was barley hand tight. it was not quite loose enough for me to think that this would cause a bad connection, but maybe thats all it takes. i mean after all, at a traffic light the bike was fine.. but when in motion, and on the gas the gauges went nuts, i'm assumng it was the vibration. i took it for a test ride after i tightened everything and all the gauges seem to work just fine, although it did stall while i was coasting through a left turn, which it's never done before. i'll have to report back after work tomorrow. thanks for the input, you guys rock!
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Old 06-30-2005, 07:05 AM
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Yep. A loose battery connection will:
Cause this problem
Blow the main fuse
Seem intermittent
Possibly fry the R/R as well.
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Old 06-30-2005, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by jschmidt";p=&quot View Post
Yep. A loose battery connection will:
Cause this problem
Blow the main fuse
Seem intermittent
Possibly fry the R/R as well.
yup.. since it wasn't the r/r i'm going to take the opportunity to replace it while it's still good.... after all its been above 100 degrees here for atleast 3 weeks and i hear they don't like heat. so i saw the r1 r/r replacement , but which thread has superblings r/r replacement? which one is better?
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