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Perceived Brake Pressure

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Old May 5, 2021 | 09:17 PM
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Perceived Brake Pressure

Does anyone out there in SH Land know of a factual, or perceived, difference in using OEM configuration (single line to Tee then one to each caliper) vs 2 lines with 1 to each caliper (race style) vs single line with over the fender connection to the other caliper? All things being the same, i.e.; Same fluid, SS lines, Etc.. I've noticed every manufacture has their own way of doing it. Most likely due to manufacturing/assembly/service ease.
Any input would be appreciated.
Old May 5, 2021 | 09:51 PM
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My understanding of fluid dynamics, which is worth about a nickel, is that all of those systems would act and feel the same. It comes down to the area of the piston exerting a force on the fluid in relation to the area of the piston or pistons being acted upon. I don't believe the size or number of lines between the two make any difference as long as the lines are large enough that they don't offer any real restriction to flow, of course. I suppose the more lines you have the more opportunities for expansion which would affect feel and power. If you had steel braided lines or whatever the cool kids are running these days, I imagine that affect would be negligible.

I suspect the different line configurations may offer other benefits. For example, dual lines, one to each caliper, may act as a better heat sink to pull heat from the pads than the other configurations. And the other configurations are probably cheaper.

I will try to ask someone who actually has hydraulics knowledge tomorrow and come back to pass that knowledge off as my own.

Last edited by VTR1000F; May 5, 2021 at 09:55 PM.
Old May 6, 2021 | 02:48 AM
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The difference between different line layouts rationale is cost of manufacturing vs ease of service. I've always found the "race" layout (2 straight hoses, double banjo bolt at the MC) the easiest to bleed. Pressure works as stated in post #2. Maybe more line area means more area to flex (expand) but the main purpose of braided lines is to prevent the line wall expansion, so it's nothing to worry.

Heat "stays" withing the caliper- it does not travel up the line by a noticeable amount.
Old May 7, 2021 | 11:58 AM
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Did the caliper upgrade, in this case from a cbr954, along with a master from same. Originally had dual lines/double banjo with that setup. Switched to a single line at the master to a tee, then one line to each caliper. I did this purely for aesthetics. There was no discernible difference, that I could feel, between the two.
Old May 7, 2021 | 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by VTR1000F
My understanding of fluid dynamics, which is worth about a nickel, is that all of those systems would act and feel the same. It comes down to the area of the piston exerting a force on the fluid in relation to the area of the piston or pistons being acted upon. I don't believe the size or number of lines between the two make any difference as long as the lines are large enough that they don't offer any real restriction to flow, of course. I suppose the more lines you have the more opportunities for expansion which would affect feel and power. If you had steel braided lines or whatever the cool kids are running these days, I imagine that affect would be negligible.

I suspect the different line configurations may offer other benefits. For example, dual lines, one to each caliper, may act as a better heat sink to pull heat from the pads than the other configurations. And the other configurations are probably cheaper.

I will try to ask someone who actually has hydraulics knowledge tomorrow and come back to pass that knowledge off as my own.
My expert says I was right. About the first part.
Old May 7, 2021 | 06:36 PM
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Thank you all for your input. Being home, retired, and recovering from surgery, I've spent 10's of hours researching this topic. I discovered, as has been discussed, there is no effective difference in any of the configurations, all parameters being generally the same. Apparently it really comes down to economics, aesthetics, and service needs. I've always used SS lines and am just switching to new (transparent red) HELs (front, rear, and clutch). I just happen to like the aesthetics of a single line with over the fender to the other side. I'm currently running dual lines to my GSXR 6 Pot Calipers.
I'll post some pics when I get this done. I've had a lot of bikes in my 55 years of riding and this '98's a keeper. 8 years and 57k+ miles, lovin' it!
I've just got find some more things to do to it. Other than major internal engine work, I'm at a loss.
Old May 7, 2021 | 06:52 PM
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Post some pictures and we can tell you what mods you forgot to do.
Old May 7, 2021 | 08:42 PM
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I'll do that as soon as I figure out what the best tires and oil I should use. I'm trying to keep it to original form, somewhat i,e.; stock looking components such as the forks. They look kind of OEM but, I've got DMr cartridges, linear springs, DLC tubes w/SKF green seals, tapered stem bearings, titanium axle, ceramic wheel bearings, GSXR pots, Galfer wave rotors, Etc.

Last edited by CaryDG; May 7, 2021 at 08:43 PM. Reason: typo
Old May 10, 2021 | 02:23 PM
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+1 It is the same!
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