"derestricted" CDI on eBay?
09-08-2011, 05:39 PM
#1
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"derestricted" CDI on eBay?
09-08-2011, 06:16 PM
#2
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Hmmmmmmmmmmm, I'd be skeptical without dyno #s posted. I know someone had one with an IDE hookup a little while back that enabled you to map your own settings, but one that's pre-programmed?
On our bikes I don't think there is a speed limiter, rev limiter, yes, but that's for the engines sake, nor does it make sense that there is a stock "horsepower limiter".
I would be intrigued to see their new timing curves and whether it matches closely to stock+factory pro advancer+ proper tps.
Now....... who on the forum has an in house dyno that they could examine this on that is particularly interested in electronics? =)
On another note, it is rather fishy that it says "Save more oil".... wtf?
On our bikes I don't think there is a speed limiter, rev limiter, yes, but that's for the engines sake, nor does it make sense that there is a stock "horsepower limiter".
I would be intrigued to see their new timing curves and whether it matches closely to stock+factory pro advancer+ proper tps.
Now....... who on the forum has an in house dyno that they could examine this on that is particularly interested in electronics? =)
On another note, it is rather fishy that it says "Save more oil".... wtf?
09-08-2011, 09:05 PM
#5
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Yeah this is a chinese knock off. It would only make sense if it were way cheap like the bodywork from there. They should have this guy write for them.
Super slick bodywork
-causes high speed to rider
-lessens maximum air drag for greater amplitude
- releases speed at all motor capacities in air space
-very shiny for energy solar absorbtion speed
Those crazy chinese! Dont get me wrong, I love em, my wife is chinese.
Super slick bodywork
-causes high speed to rider
-lessens maximum air drag for greater amplitude
- releases speed at all motor capacities in air space
-very shiny for energy solar absorbtion speed
Those crazy chinese! Dont get me wrong, I love em, my wife is chinese.
09-08-2011, 09:56 PM
#6
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Hmmmmmmmmmmm, I'd be skeptical without dyno #s posted. I know someone had one with an IDE hookup a little while back that enabled you to map your own settings, but one that's pre-programmed?
On our bikes I don't think there is a speed limiter, rev limiter, yes, but that's for the engines sake, nor does it make sense that there is a stock "horsepower limiter".
I would be intrigued to see their new timing curves and whether it matches closely to stock+factory pro advancer+ proper tps.
Now....... who on the forum has an in house dyno that they could examine this on that is particularly interested in electronics? =)
On another note, it is rather fishy that it says "Save more oil".... wtf?
On our bikes I don't think there is a speed limiter, rev limiter, yes, but that's for the engines sake, nor does it make sense that there is a stock "horsepower limiter".
I would be intrigued to see their new timing curves and whether it matches closely to stock+factory pro advancer+ proper tps.
Now....... who on the forum has an in house dyno that they could examine this on that is particularly interested in electronics? =)
On another note, it is rather fishy that it says "Save more oil".... wtf?
Things just come a crossed different at times in the translation.
Hell it took me a hour or so to figure out a "+ driver" was actually a phillips head driver one time.....but that is a different story.....
So some of the things listed are pretty generic for all the boxes they make and yes some bikes did come with a "speed limiter" and they just say it will work with any HP engine not that there is a HP limiter installed. On some Fuel injected bikes this might be an issue.
As for "Save more oil" I would take that as " Save more Gas" or "Increases MPG"
Now for your question, all I can say is that if it is a "reversed engineered" HRC box, it will give you better performance than just a static advancer.
So the only real question would be is it really a HRC copy?
and what is the quality of the ignition?
09-09-2011, 10:43 AM
#8
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One thing I did notice is that the ad doesn't say what year(s) the ignition is for.
The HRC boxes only worked on the '98-'00 (or '97-'00 depending on what part of the world you are in....) model years. After that they changed the plug on the ECU.
So that is another question about this part....
The HRC boxes only worked on the '98-'00 (or '97-'00 depending on what part of the world you are in....) model years. After that they changed the plug on the ECU.
So that is another question about this part....
09-09-2011, 11:21 AM
#9
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SuperSport
Join Date: Sep 2008
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Bet you anything this is not something special - As smoking Joe said this is just a knock off. I doubt it is a HRC knock off. If whoever made this expended the effort to secure a HRC ignition and then copy it they certainly would have said as much in the description.
As far as the HRC box is concerned, didn't Markus find one? I haven't searched, but I thought he was going to install it and report back...
As far as the HRC box is concerned, didn't Markus find one? I haven't searched, but I thought he was going to install it and report back...
09-09-2011, 12:44 PM
#10
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Bet you anything this is not something special - As smoking Joe said this is just a knock off. I doubt it is a HRC knock off. If whoever made this expended the effort to secure a HRC ignition and then copy it they certainly would have said as much in the description.
As far as the HRC box is concerned, didn't Markus find one? I haven't searched, but I thought he was going to install it and report back...
As far as the HRC box is concerned, didn't Markus find one? I haven't searched, but I thought he was going to install it and report back...
With the 4 degree advancer, the bike pulls well and revs pretty quick. While the bike can still run on 87 with this set up it is happier with 89 which makes sense due to the fixed advance.
With the HRC box you loose the side stand safety circuit, so the bike will run with the side stand down, something to be careful about on a street bike.
Also the rev limit is changed. I have heard 2 different things on this but never personally tried it to find out. The most "reliable" source stated that the rev limiter was set at 11K. The second source stated that there is no rev limiter.
though like I said I never tried it....Now for how the bike runs. IMHO from around 4-6k both set ups are pretty close. Everywhere else the HRC unit pulls harder and revs a bit quicker. So the reprogrammed curves do work. Another way to see that you get more overall advance with the HRC unit is that the bike can run on 89 if you have to but you get the best performance with 92.
Now the 2 draw backs to the HRC box is that it is only for the first generation bikes ('97-'00) and they are not cheap if you do happen to find one.
Then again the 4 degree advancer is also only for the first generation bikes. It really doesn't work very well with the '01 and later ECU.
09-09-2011, 12:58 PM
#11
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Bet you anything this is not something special - As smoking Joe said this is just a knock off. I doubt it is a HRC knock off. If whoever made this expended the effort to secure a HRC ignition and then copy it they certainly would have said as much in the description.
As far as the HRC box is concerned, didn't Markus find one? I haven't searched, but I thought he was going to install it and report back...
As far as the HRC box is concerned, didn't Markus find one? I haven't searched, but I thought he was going to install it and report back...
But I'm now running a fully programmable box...Well I can answer the HRC questions also. Though I don't have dyno numbers, just my observations.
With the 4 degree advancer, the bike pulls well and revs pretty quick. While the bike can still run on 87 with this set up it is happier with 89 which makes sense due to the fixed advance.
With the HRC box you loose the side stand safety circuit, so the bike will run with the side stand down, something to be careful about on a street bike.
Also the rev limit is changed. I have heard 2 different things on this but never personally tried it to find out. The most "reliable" source stated that the rev limiter was set at 11K. The second source stated that there is no rev limiter. though like I said I never tried it....
Now for how the bike runs. IMHO from around 4-6k both set ups are pretty close. Everywhere else the HRC unit pulls harder and revs a bit quicker. So the reprogrammed curves do work. Another way to see that you get more overall advance with the HRC unit is that the bike can run on 89 if you have to but you get the best performance with 92.
Now the 2 draw backs to the HRC box is that it is only for the first generation bikes ('97-'00) and they are not cheap if you do happen to find one.
Then again the 4 degree advancer is also only for the first generation bikes. It really doesn't work very well with the '01 and later ECU.
With the 4 degree advancer, the bike pulls well and revs pretty quick. While the bike can still run on 87 with this set up it is happier with 89 which makes sense due to the fixed advance.
With the HRC box you loose the side stand safety circuit, so the bike will run with the side stand down, something to be careful about on a street bike.
Also the rev limit is changed. I have heard 2 different things on this but never personally tried it to find out. The most "reliable" source stated that the rev limiter was set at 11K. The second source stated that there is no rev limiter.
though like I said I never tried it....Now for how the bike runs. IMHO from around 4-6k both set ups are pretty close. Everywhere else the HRC unit pulls harder and revs a bit quicker. So the reprogrammed curves do work. Another way to see that you get more overall advance with the HRC unit is that the bike can run on 89 if you have to but you get the best performance with 92.
Now the 2 draw backs to the HRC box is that it is only for the first generation bikes ('97-'00) and they are not cheap if you do happen to find one.
Then again the 4 degree advancer is also only for the first generation bikes. It really doesn't work very well with the '01 and later ECU.
The only observation I can add... IF there is a revlimiter, it's not at 11k... I briefly hit 11.3k, but didn't dare keep going, and it didn't cut it there... Could very well be a revlimiter higher up, dunno where... But I'm to chickenshit to find out...
My programmable box has a hard limiter at 11k for now...
Last edited by Tweety; 09-09-2011 at 01:01 PM.
09-09-2011, 01:38 PM
#12
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I guess they figure you might need that last 500RPM to make the pass out of the final corner and it's up to the rider to decide if the engine can take it.... and they are going to tear it down anyways so..... but not a great feature on a "street" bike.
That is why I stated both "facts" about the rev limit that I was given. Both "sources" were well placed so I didn't know which one to believe. So, with that information, I would have to believe that it has no rev limiter, which is actually typical for HRC racing ignitions. Though if some one wants to try to find out...... please post the info.......
Though I guess I'm getting old, as I tend to stay around 1K away from the stock 10.3K rev limit anymore, so it doesn't matter all that much to me either way.......
09-09-2011, 02:25 PM
#13
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Trust me, I'm not typically tooling around at those RPM's...
If there is a revlimiter on that HRC box, I'm not verifying it... I like my engine running, thank you... That was one of the reasons I swapped to the programmable box...
If there is a revlimiter on that HRC box, I'm not verifying it... I like my engine running, thank you...
That was one of the reasons I swapped to the programmable box...
09-11-2011, 02:20 AM
#14
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SuperSport
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Madison Wisconsin
Posts: 655
So I guess my question is for Tweety what kind of box are you running and cost and such. Might be something that I need for my new engine rebuild that is slowly coming cash is tight but next summer is the finish date so could add that to the wishlist.
Thanks
Thanks
09-11-2011, 04:20 AM
#15
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Unless you are doing a full Stage 2 build, it's probably a waste of money outrigth though, the gains without extensive work on the rest of the engine isn't too great...
09-11-2011, 06:23 AM
#16
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How difficult would it be to buy the Programmable box from Ignitech and progam it with the HRC curve? Having looked at Ignitech's price list, their products (for VTR, from what I can tell, assuming, of course it it is the "SPARKER HONDA TCI" that is needed) seem quite affordable.
Last edited by mikstr; 09-11-2011 at 06:27 AM.
09-11-2011, 07:02 AM
#17
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Defenitely affordable... And defenitely not complicated to change the parameters, simply hook it to a PC... However, since I haven't got the HRC values, I more or less extrapolated from the stock numbers, testing on dyno... Trial and error...
I could give pointers, but doing it without access to a dyno would be rather time consuming...
I could give pointers, but doing it without access to a dyno would be rather time consuming...
09-11-2011, 09:40 AM
#18
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Do ytou think it would be possible to somehow extract the mapping from an HRC box and program an Ignitech box.
I am thinking group purchase here....... (given that the programmable boxes are listed at only 80 Euros.....). We could pay someone to do the actual programming and still come out at a decent price....
I am thinking group purchase here....... (given that the programmable boxes are listed at only 80 Euros.....). We could pay someone to do the actual programming and still come out at a decent price....
09-11-2011, 10:41 AM
#19
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Well Rama had the guys at Ignitech get a map of the stock ignition and posted it here:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...52/#post268061
(it in post #10 if it doesn't link directly to it.....)
So it might be possible to do the same type of thing with a HRC unit.
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...52/#post268061
(it in post #10 if it doesn't link directly to it.....)
So it might be possible to do the same type of thing with a HRC unit.
09-11-2011, 03:12 PM
#20
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Well... Yes, in theory I could hook up a osciloscope to the HRC box on the dyno and extract the data... But that's a lot of hourss of datalogging, calculation and whatnot... I just couldn't be bothered doing that... So I started with the data that Rama posted up...
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