Best mod
04-02-2013, 06:46 AM
#61
Out of my mind, back in 5
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I got a shock from Jamie, and paid for stiffer springs, and a shop to install them and do custom valving for my weight...all of that together cost approximately 500 bucks...I started tracking the bike with that setup with the stock brakes (some EBC HH pads), and it was awesome!
Was it "wobbly" or whatever like Tweety suggests above? Probably...did I care? No...because I didn't know any better, not having ridden any other bikes on the track before....even as a beginner I could tell the stock stuff sucked though, the bike would bottom out over some bumps, and the front end was like a pogo stick on the track.
The hawk isn't a racing bike, USD forks are not worth the money IMO, but if you can only have one motorcycle and you've chosen the hawk, then going the full 9 yards on the front end is probably worth it....
Was it "wobbly" or whatever like Tweety suggests above? Probably...did I care? No...because I didn't know any better, not having ridden any other bikes on the track before....even as a beginner I could tell the stock stuff sucked though, the bike would bottom out over some bumps, and the front end was like a pogo stick on the track.
The hawk isn't a racing bike, USD forks are not worth the money IMO, but if you can only have one motorcycle and you've chosen the hawk, then going the full 9 yards on the front end is probably worth it....
But the difference to the USD fork felt about as great as the re-worked stock fork did... So with all things totaled up, with improved brakes... Not just stopping power, but also feel and moderation as well as stability, I find it worth the money... (Plus I made back a good chunk selling of my worked stock fork)
So, no I'm not saying the "one mod" should be a USD fork... I'm saying suspension... In as much as you want to spend on it... Every step along the way helps, and is worthwhile...
04-02-2013, 01:13 PM
#62
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A bafflectomy is much less costly than a set of $500 slip-ons. And arguably a much better way to open up some exhaust flow by saving a few bucks at the price of a few pounds and aesthetics. So why buy slip ons? Lots of people do, and I think someone earlier in the thread said swapping exhaust was their favorite mod. Does it count as a mod if it's too expensive?
Which is the best budget mod? That may be an entirely different and interesting subject. Maybe something like, if you had $100 and a stock Superhawk, what would you spend it on?
Front end swap is costly- I don't think anyone is saying it's an inexpensive mod when done properly. But as seen on another thread, a used 6.3 gallon gas tank costs $1500 and gets you, what, a 50 extra miles of riding per fillup? I think that counts as one mod...
Anyway, just throwing more into the Jambalaya.
Cat- I get that you're pointing out the importance of adjusting suspension and not just throwing money at something before you know what you're doing (especially when just tuning the stock setup will get you a long way). That's a fair warning, and should really be considered with any modification- carbeurator tuning for example.
Which is the best budget mod? That may be an entirely different and interesting subject. Maybe something like, if you had $100 and a stock Superhawk, what would you spend it on?
Front end swap is costly- I don't think anyone is saying it's an inexpensive mod when done properly. But as seen on another thread, a used 6.3 gallon gas tank costs $1500 and gets you, what, a 50 extra miles of riding per fillup? I think that counts as one mod...
Anyway, just throwing more into the Jambalaya.
Cat- I get that you're pointing out the importance of adjusting suspension and not just throwing money at something before you know what you're doing (especially when just tuning the stock setup will get you a long way). That's a fair warning, and should really be considered with any modification- carbeurator tuning for example.
04-02-2013, 01:26 PM
#63
drive for pleasure
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in the very start of this topic there should be separated mods,on ones up to 100s,and ones over 100s...just like 7moore7 said before...
and as i said in my previous post,before we all start to make an engenier of ourself,the stock posibilities should be explored to its limit,regardles to expirience...
thats the master reason why i decided to start with tuning the stock suspension
and as i said in my previous post,before we all start to make an engenier of ourself,the stock posibilities should be explored to its limit,regardles to expirience...
thats the master reason why i decided to start with tuning the stock suspension
04-02-2013, 01:33 PM
#64
drive for pleasure
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Question to all of ya,what with the brake mods?what do you recomend,so far i know there is not too many adjustment options with stock ones,.
su upgrading braking system would be fair well done job,and well invested money worth every penny
su upgrading braking system would be fair well done job,and well invested money worth every penny
04-02-2013, 01:50 PM
#65
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IMO, any HP, torque, brake improvement done seem counter intuitive without proper suspension tune to use existing HP, torque and brakes to the max.
VTR already has plenty of torque and HP, just know know to use them and use them at their max require fine suspension tune for specific terrain and road conditions.
Even if you have the perfect valving/spring rate figured out, without the proper oil (viscosity and/or level), your suspension not going to perform properly. Stating: "Oil viscosity is not a tuning mechanism." is simply incorrect.
Personally, I try to use the brakes as little as possible, always look for ways to go around before using the brakes; since they only limit your options and reduce control of your vehicle.
VTR already has plenty of torque and HP, just know know to use them and use them at their max require fine suspension tune for specific terrain and road conditions.
Even if you have the perfect valving/spring rate figured out, without the proper oil (viscosity and/or level), your suspension not going to perform properly. Stating: "Oil viscosity is not a tuning mechanism." is simply incorrect.
Personally, I try to use the brakes as little as possible, always look for ways to go around before using the brakes; since they only limit your options and reduce control of your vehicle.
04-02-2013, 02:07 PM
#66
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04-02-2013, 02:32 PM
#67
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To spend all that money, it almost seems to go with a different bike. But I love my bird. How much could all of that suspension upgrade cost? Although I've only had my bike just over a year and this is my first bike, I don't really know any better. And I'm still keeping up with the other guys. I'd prob have to ride someone else's to see the difference, but I doubt that'll happen.
04-02-2013, 03:50 PM
#69
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Everything included came out to around $850 give or take.
Forks/triples/clipons- $330
Wheel & rotors- $150
New allballs bearings for wheel/stem $40
Calipers/pads -$90
New stainless lines- $90
Chinese carbon fiber fender $100
Edit:^ these are estimates... but a couple weeks on e-bay should have similar results.
This was initial cost. I made about $200 back by selling my old stuff, and that's only because I turned the front fender into a windscreen and the old wheel into a bar stool stand. My stock parts weren't in the best of shape, with better stock items I could easily have doubled that.
Last edited by 7moore7; 04-02-2013 at 03:54 PM.
04-02-2013, 03:54 PM
#70
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If we going that far to separate the mod's, how about building a single thread that will act as data base source that contains all the mods and links to related info' on the forum and elsewhere on the net? Or instead of a thread, we can have some kind of an index page, I just think that a thread will be more like a live manual of sort, but it will need to be strictly enforced to be just that.
Just an idea
Just an idea
04-02-2013, 04:04 PM
#71
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You mean like a "what's needed" type of thing? Or...?
I mean, we have stickies for some of this stuff:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ke-mods-13176/
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...p-guide-23751/
In all honesty, while there are a bunch of separate parts, I still kind of consider a front swap one mod... you can't buy any of those things in the list and use them one at a time; you have to put it all on at once, as a unit.
Edit: Istrijan, that first link's for you
I mean, we have stickies for some of this stuff:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ke-mods-13176/
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...p-guide-23751/
In all honesty, while there are a bunch of separate parts, I still kind of consider a front swap one mod... you can't buy any of those things in the list and use them one at a time; you have to put it all on at once, as a unit.
Edit: Istrijan, that first link's for you
Last edited by 7moore7; 04-02-2013 at 04:08 PM.
04-02-2013, 04:17 PM
#72
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If we going that far to separate the mod's, how about building a single thread that will act as data base source that contains all the mods and links to related info' on the forum and elsewhere on the net? Or instead of a thread, we can have some kind of an index page, I just think that a thread will be more like a live manual of sort, but it will need to be strictly enforced to be just that.
Just an idea
Just an idea
04-02-2013, 04:20 PM
#73
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Very valid. Some things that are perfectly reasonable to some people seem outrageous to others. But why not? The motor's nice on this bike. Vtr's aren't that expensive... if you try to buy any bike with USD forks on it for less than 4k (I don't think it's out of the question to buy a vtr plus USD forks for 4k), you're going to be looking for a long time.
Everything included came out to around $850 give or take.
Forks/triples/clipons- $330
Wheel & rotors- $150
New allballs bearings for wheel/stem $40
Calipers/pads -$90
New stainless lines- $90
Chinese carbon fiber fender $100
Edit:^ these are estimates... but a couple weeks on e-bay should have similar results.
This was initial cost. I made about $200 back by selling my old stuff, and that's only because I turned the front fender into a windscreen and the old wheel into a bar stool stand. My stock parts weren't in the best of shape, with better stock items I could easily have doubled that.
Everything included came out to around $850 give or take.
Forks/triples/clipons- $330
Wheel & rotors- $150
New allballs bearings for wheel/stem $40
Calipers/pads -$90
New stainless lines- $90
Chinese carbon fiber fender $100
Edit:^ these are estimates... but a couple weeks on e-bay should have similar results.
This was initial cost. I made about $200 back by selling my old stuff, and that's only because I turned the front fender into a windscreen and the old wheel into a bar stool stand. My stock parts weren't in the best of shape, with better stock items I could easily have doubled that.
04-02-2013, 04:25 PM
#74
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That sounds like a monumental task. Way too much work, plus I wouldn't want to be that guy for fear of forgetting something!
04-02-2013, 04:26 PM
#75
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I paid $850, (so had to have that cash up front), did the swap, then sold $200 worth of it. But I think I could have sold everything for $500 if I was motivated and didn't just let it go for cheap to other forum members...
So I'm $650 down. But I think with proper planning and patience you could do the swap for $350 all said and done...
So I'm $650 down. But I think with proper planning and patience you could do the swap for $350 all said and done...
04-02-2013, 04:36 PM
#76
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04-02-2013, 04:48 PM
#77
Banned
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Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
04-02-2013, 04:50 PM
#78
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You mean like a "what's needed" type of thing? Or...?
I mean, we have stickies for some of this stuff:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ke-mods-13176/
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...p-guide-23751/
I mean, we have stickies for some of this stuff:
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ke-mods-13176/
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...p-guide-23751/
04-02-2013, 04:52 PM
#79
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+1 agreed, I consider that a single mod as well
04-02-2013, 04:53 PM
#80
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Really?? The two track schools I've attended would completely disagree with you.
Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
I'm surprised they didn't start out the day with a "no brakes" drill. That teaches throttle control which is MUCH more important than brakes. With the schools I've been involved with the brakes don't show up until the afternoon and even then it is very light brakes allowed.
Just my experiences.
04-02-2013, 05:00 PM
#81
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Agree, but that can be done by help of all the members, as I mentioned it will need to be strictly enforced to Mod's only, no discussions! We can also organized this as an index of sort for all the links and related info'
04-02-2013, 05:06 PM
#82
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Really?? The two track schools I've attended would completely disagree with you.
Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
Last edited by NHSH; 04-02-2013 at 05:09 PM.
04-02-2013, 05:15 PM
#83
El Cheapo
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Really?? The two track schools I've attended would completely disagree with you.
Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
Before you bad mouth the schools first know that one was the Freddy Spencer school and the other was one run by Doug Chandler.
Both of these guys have said you need to understand & practice braking to stay in control along with other advanced techniques for chassis control through using the brakes.
So IMHO saying that using the brakes reduces your control of the bike, yes on a paved surface, is just plan silly.
I come from a bicycle messenger/desert racing background; on/off pavement and sidewalks are all fair game if I can avoid impact with a tree (inmovable object) or another vehicle.
I understand that every time you hit the brakes, you are taking away available traction to your front tire to steer; which limit your options to where you can go with your vehicle.
When in doubt, gas it out; that's my way of riding in the desert.
I only hit the brakes when there are no other options.
In my experience, the fastest rider on the track don't have the fastest bike, but usually uses their brakes the least. Wouldn't you agree?
I thought you were done with this thread in the last page..
That image is on public road, not track riding.
Last edited by cat0020; 04-02-2013 at 05:20 PM.
04-02-2013, 05:31 PM
#84
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I think that's also what Cat is pointing out in a roundabout sort of way.
It's not cut and dry, but let me throw a couple of things out that I was considering when making the swap without adding the tuning cost:
Stock 929rr forks are sprung and valved for a bike/rider closer to what I need than stock VTR forks. Still not quite heavy enough, but much closer...
You spring and valve the superhawk forks and then add a fork brace and you're done. If you want more out of them or your brakes, high on the list of improvements is to start again at ground zero with a fork swap...
And if we're talking brakes... I use my bike for commuting. I like the better modulation and feel of the larger rotors and calipers in the city as that very slight extra safety factor. Stock ones work just fine, but why oh why would you upgrade ANYTHING if the stock stuff works just fine? It was all designed by Honda to be one specific bike, so shouldn't be touched. Buy the color you like and keep the fluids fresh!
04-02-2013, 05:43 PM
#86
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04-02-2013, 05:46 PM
#87
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If you can find a member upgrading to USDs you can get a great front end cheap. I paid 500 for a set of 900rr forks with racetech internals setup up by traxxis suspension work and they came with 320mm ebc rotors 900rr calipers, stainless lines and TBR triples. All I had to add were clip ons and work. I also traded my stock front end to Jamie for credit towards a fantastic rear shock. Nothing on motorcycles is cheap but suspension and brakes are worth every penny and you could throw a grand at the stock superhawk stuff and not touch my setup.
04-02-2013, 05:53 PM
#88
THE LANE CARVER
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I concur. Actually I think a page where all users can add so it isn't all placed on one soul to manage. Maybe a couple admins for it so no one can delete or change someone else's work. But it'd be nice having a lot of that kind of information in one easily searched area. Just a thought. Or some may call me 'lazy' i.e. E.Marquez haha [he got me the other day]. But even if its like the basic info. Most of us don't know what the capable additions and changes are. I've spent a lot of time searching the site and most searches don't get answers for me.
04-02-2013, 06:01 PM
#89
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As I do, I think most new guys here would value all of your ideas and mods. I just wish I had some kind of list to look at what's available for me, and what parts of other bikes are compatible with my stock bike- like all the brake threads I've seen and so forth. That's prob the one I've most interested in- brake upgrade. Or actually better stopping power, by what I'm learning seems the suspension has a lot to do with that as well. This site is definitely an educator.
04-02-2013, 06:04 PM
#90
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