MOSFET Regulator/Rectifiers - The Why & The How
Thread Starter
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Well... Riding bitch might hurt your pride... But since with a failed open diode in the R/R it will put out 15-16V at idle and more if you go above idle, it's the only option that won't take out your ECU... The only possible way you could limp that bike home is to ride all the way in first gear, hand off the throttle.. And even that is risky...
Either go find a Honda dealership locally and get raped for a crappy OEM replacement R/R... Or scrounge up a good replacement and a place to do the work, or put the bike on a trailer/truck home... All the other options will bite you in the ***...
Either go find a Honda dealership locally and get raped for a crappy OEM replacement R/R... Or scrounge up a good replacement and a place to do the work, or put the bike on a trailer/truck home... All the other options will bite you in the ***...
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
I just finished switching over my R/R to a Mosfet-type (Shindengen FH012AA) so thanks again Markus for raising awareness of this issue. I dreaded the thought of an R/R failure taking out my new (and oh so rare and hard to find) HRC ignition box....
cheers
cheers
über-n00b
Superstock
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 257
From: S. WI
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 28
I have a question.....why isn't anyone but me using thermal paste on the stock one? Not one mention of thermal paste anywhere. Anyone who's repaired a processor in a PC, or replaced a module in a automotive distributer knows how critical a thermal bond is with the backing plate/heatsink. The backside of the R/R is polished metal for a reason, and so I applied some thermal paste when I reinstalled it as I noticed some discoloration of the paint where it attaches. I didn't realise these were a problem until I saw this thread, and after reading the very well thought out commentary on why I should upgrade, I didn't see any mention of thermal paste. Not trying to whiz on anyone here, just would like to know if this has already been tried or not and were the results positive.
Tracy
Tracy
Old and dangerous
SuperSport
SuperSport
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 604
From: DFW Texas
And this one: https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...68/#post184506
And this: http://www.burniemorgan.com/firestorm/reg_heatsink.html
Here, another member asks the question: https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...44/#post266890
And another: https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...63/#post253150
And here: https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...17/#post297866
I can do this all night...
Not really, I'm done.
Find them all here=> MAGIC
Do the same search for "thermal" and you will find even more talk, like this one: https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...51/#post227016
Last edited by rz_racer_69; Apr 1, 2012 at 08:59 PM.
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 442
From: Little Rock, AR
So Tweety,
My question is...of the recommended R/R models in the early posts: which ones can handle the outputs of the SuperHawk. The 600s seem to take an FH008 model, and the bigger bikes take an FH0012 or 0014 or 0015.
Which ones will work? I still have a working stock model, but don't want it to die soon/unexpectedly.
Andy
My question is...of the recommended R/R models in the early posts: which ones can handle the outputs of the SuperHawk. The 600s seem to take an FH008 model, and the bigger bikes take an FH0012 or 0014 or 0015.
Which ones will work? I still have a working stock model, but don't want it to die soon/unexpectedly.
Andy
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
Alas, it's now done, and my beloved HRC ignition is now safe
Last edited by mikstr; Apr 2, 2012 at 07:25 PM.
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 14
I am hoping that you guys monitor this thread. We are on a 3 day ride. We left Friday afternoon from Tulsa and when we got to Fayetteville, my bike wouldn't start. I jump started it and went to Autozone and got a new battery. I had it on the battery tender over Thursday night and my battery was about 4 years old. It seemed pretty warm but I just chalked the issue up to age. Today we were 200 miles into the trip, buzzing along and my bike just quit all together. No lights at all. The day old sealed battery was smoking - I think the battery acid was seaping out around the edges creating the smoke/steam. So, my buddy went and bought new battery number 2 for the weekend as we were 50 miles from anywhere. The bike started up again, the headlight bulb has burned out and the tach doesn't work. All other lights and functions are fine.
Anyway, limped to our hotel 40 miles away (which was interesting without a headlight after dark).
Now I am wondering what I can do to limp home in the morning:
Any help would be appreciated!
Thanks,
John
Anyway, limped to our hotel 40 miles away (which was interesting without a headlight after dark).
Now I am wondering what I can do to limp home in the morning:
- Can I get a voltmeter and find the peak rpm that creates 14.4V or less (assuming a fuse fixes my tach or memorize the sound at that rpm)? Then just keep it under that until we make it straight home.
- Do I need to drive, say, an hour at a time and them stop to let everything cool down for 30 minutes? Both failed batteries were pretty hot. But I don't normally mess with the battery to know if that is really normal.
- Just ride and have a good time and see if I can make it home before I cook another battery?
- Am I going to cause more problems by riding the bike like this? Riding bitch back to Tulsa and coming back with a truck doesn't sound too tempting...
Any help would be appreciated!
Thanks,
John
I just checked voltage on a few things:
- burned out headlight (happened when my battery failed): 12v at the socket
- front indicator light above headlight (I noticed this a few months ago but didn't mess with it): 12v at the socket
- tach: I finally checked and all fuses are intact and it doesn't have it's own fuse. I will check this later to see if it is getting voltage or not. I 'spose I don't require a tach to ride...
- battery with bike off: 13.4v
- battery with bike at idle: 14.0v
- battery with bike at various rpms: 13.8v-14.0v
This is what my regulator looks like.
The website says: 12 Volt, 14.4 Voltset
Replaces: Honda: 31600-MV4-000, 31600-KY2-703
Shindengen: SH633-12
The sticker on the back of mine says "0615 U.S." There isn't enough info to bring up a search result on "0615 U.S."... I did notice that someone has marked on the connector with a marker... I could not disconnect it from the wiring harness on my first go...
Anyway, I just wanted to check to see that these symptoms do align with a failing R/R. It seems that mine is failing slowly since I am seeing good readings right now.
If I do in fact need a R/R, is it okay to buy something like this used?
It looks like my options are:
universal kit on ebay: $125
Used Kawasaki R/R on ebay: $39 to $95
I don't see any results on other options where I can see the markings to verify it is a mosfet style.
Any advice on this would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
John
Last edited by ridinon0$; Apr 2, 2012 at 07:42 PM.
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,871
From: Phoenix, AZ
I would buy a used MOSFET over a new oem any day of the week. Yes, your R/R is showing symptoms of failing. Especially since it has failed before and you only treated the symptoms, not the cause.
If you buy a MOSFET, you will need to do a small amount of wiring work. It's very easy, I would trust just about anyone to handle the operation, but know that it will not be plug and play.
The easiest way to tell if its MOSFET is if it has and FH at the front of the markings. Yours has and SH at the beginning, indicating the older shunt based regulator. Tweety put a list in at the beginning of the thread... the universal kit that you listed is a great option as it is a MOSFET R/R with a waterproof wiring harness. Basically it's everything you need at a good quality.
If you buy a MOSFET, you will need to do a small amount of wiring work. It's very easy, I would trust just about anyone to handle the operation, but know that it will not be plug and play.
The easiest way to tell if its MOSFET is if it has and FH at the front of the markings. Yours has and SH at the beginning, indicating the older shunt based regulator. Tweety put a list in at the beginning of the thread... the universal kit that you listed is a great option as it is a MOSFET R/R with a waterproof wiring harness. Basically it's everything you need at a good quality.
Last edited by 7moore7; Apr 2, 2012 at 08:31 PM.
Thread Starter
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Well, I'm just guessing here, but you took these readings with the bike at idle on your driveway most probably... You might consider the fact that the failures of the diodes inside the R/R usually show up when they are up to temp, after 30+ minutes of riding... I'd say your results are very typical of needing a new R/R... Pronto...
Thread Starter
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
So Tweety,
My question is...of the recommended R/R models in the early posts: which ones can handle the outputs of the SuperHawk. The 600s seem to take an FH008 model, and the bigger bikes take an FH0012 or 0014 or 0015.
Which ones will work? I still have a working stock model, but don't want it to die soon/unexpectedly.
Andy
My question is...of the recommended R/R models in the early posts: which ones can handle the outputs of the SuperHawk. The 600s seem to take an FH008 model, and the bigger bikes take an FH0012 or 0014 or 0015.
Which ones will work? I still have a working stock model, but don't want it to die soon/unexpectedly.
Andy
The newer model bikes all have a lot more electronics than our old bike, so even the 600's have an R/R capable of outputting more than our bike needs...
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
I picked up a DIY R/R kit on eBay (just do a search using the model listed). It comes with most of what you need. I then ordered some cables with ready-made connectors (ones that fit into the RR, one grey and one black) and went from there. I ended up with some duplicate parts (connectors and wire) as a result but having the EB stuff helped allay my fears about my own electrical incompetence.
You can surely just buy the RR alone and get the EB wire harnesses. It`s a straight splice and connect job after that.
Good luck!
Thread Starter
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
It was more idle curiosity... I was really baffled by the thought that I'd recommend something that wouldn't work...
If it's listed, it's verified to work... (or noted otherwise)
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 29
From: Racine, WI.
It may seem $$$, but roadstercycle.com has a FH012AA super mosfet R/R kit for $137. Everything is already put together, just hook up the new
battery cables and the 3 wires to the stator and your done.
battery cables and the 3 wires to the stator and your done.
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 14
It looks like you installed the same model that comes in the universal kit on eBay. My plan was to (painfully) figure out the wiring for that unit and then post it here but it seems that you just worked it out. Would you mind laying that out for us?
Thanks,
John
Thread Starter
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Hey mikstr,
It looks like you installed the same model that comes in the universal kit on eBay. My plan was to (painfully) figure out the wiring for that unit and then post it here but it seems that you just worked it out. Would you mind laying that out for us?
Thanks,
John
It looks like you installed the same model that comes in the universal kit on eBay. My plan was to (painfully) figure out the wiring for that unit and then post it here but it seems that you just worked it out. Would you mind laying that out for us?
Thanks,
John
And even if it hadn't been posted, how hard is it? There's two plugs, one with three wires that goes to the stator (no polarity, hook them up any order you like), and one with two wires going to the battery... The only thing you could manage to muck up even if you tried was to hook the positive and negative up in reverse, and blow a fuse... Other than that it's idiot proof...
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 14
Seriously dude... It's been posted a number of times... Once in this thread as well...
And even if it hadn't been posted, how hard is it? There's two plugs, one with three wires that goes to the stator (no polarity, hook them up any order you like), and one with two wires going to the battery... The only thing you could manage to muck up even if you tried was to hook the positive and negative up in reverse, and blow a fuse... Other than that it's idiot proof...
And even if it hadn't been posted, how hard is it? There's two plugs, one with three wires that goes to the stator (no polarity, hook them up any order you like), and one with two wires going to the battery... The only thing you could manage to muck up even if you tried was to hook the positive and negative up in reverse, and blow a fuse... Other than that it's idiot proof...
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,871
From: Phoenix, AZ
He's just having fun 'cause it's pretty uncomplicated. Pretty much all R/R's are the same for sportbikes. 3 yellow wires in any order (ok, maybe a couple of them have 2). One hot and one ground wire. Aaaaaand you're done.
But for someone who doesn't know that, I get your point. Maybe I can take a picture of mine tonight (as it would pretty much be a wiring diagram). There are a few fh---- models out there with exactly the same wiring.
But for someone who doesn't know that, I get your point. Maybe I can take a picture of mine tonight (as it would pretty much be a wiring diagram). There are a few fh---- models out there with exactly the same wiring.
Thread Starter
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Just FYI, there are about 5 different threads, with the exact info, pictures and explanations... A valuable skill on this forum is to search, there are heaps of info availabe in "old" threads... And once you have read them, if you have a follow up question, we'll gladly answer it... But when you ask one of the top ten or so most asked questions, me and others will have a bit of fun with you before handing the answer on a silver platter...
Besides, I do come with a warning label nowadays, on popular demand... See the sigline...
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 14
Alright, I think I have got it down, but if it isn't obvious, I am not totally confident. If I did it right, then it is a guide for others. If I did it wrong, hopefully I can get it right with a little feedback . I have just mocked the wires into place. The 3 yellows are in any order. I am using the fused lead straight to the battery and I will tape off the existing red wire. I still need to mount the ground wire through the bolt.
How did I do?
Universal Mosfet RR on eBay
Also, I think I lost one of the waterproof boots - Can I just fill one of the holes with glue?
. I have just mocked the wires into place. The 3 yellows are in any order. I am using the fused lead straight to the battery and I will tape off the existing red wire. I still need to mount the ground wire through the bolt.How did I do?
Universal Mosfet RR on eBay
Also, I think I lost one of the waterproof boots - Can I just fill one of the holes with glue?
Retired- but not tired!
SuperBike
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,481
From: Pittsburgh
Alright, I think I have got it down, but if it isn't obvious, I am not totally confident. If I did it right, then it is a guide for others. If I did it wrong, hopefully I can get it right with a little feedback . I have just mocked the wires into place. The 3 yellows are in any order. I am using the fused lead straight to the battery and I will tape off the existing red wire. I still need to mount the ground wire through the bolt.
How did I do?
Universal Mosfet RR on eBay
Also, I think I lost one of the waterproof boots - Can I just fill one of the holes with glue?
. I have just mocked the wires into place. The 3 yellows are in any order. I am using the fused lead straight to the battery and I will tape off the existing red wire. I still need to mount the ground wire through the bolt.How did I do?
Universal Mosfet RR on eBay
Also, I think I lost one of the waterproof boots - Can I just fill one of the holes with glue?
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,871
From: Phoenix, AZ
You got it! At least that's how mine is wired. Now if anyone needs a pic or wiring diagram we have super extra large one in the thread.
On the very small off chance that you blow your main fuse when you turn it on (it'll happen as soon as you turn the key) Just switch the red/green wires and replace your fuse
On the very small off chance that you blow your main fuse when you turn it on (it'll happen as soon as you turn the key) Just switch the red/green wires and replace your fuse
RUNLEVELZERO #99
SuperBike
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,218
From: Skokie
Your ground (green) wire looks like to light a gauge; it should be maybe at most one size down from the hot (red) and also go direct to the battery. The OE hot (red/white) should be snipped off or better, used to power an auxiliary circuit like a second rear brake light (with a new in-line fuse). The OE ground can be used for the negative for the same auxiliary circuit.
Note the OE hot & ground in photo 10 in the background. Since its a DC circuit the OE red/white can back-feed from the main fuse instead of feed in. Easy way to supply another circuit or even a small load center (buss bar).
Note the OE hot & ground in photo 10 in the background. Since its a DC circuit the OE red/white can back-feed from the main fuse instead of feed in. Easy way to supply another circuit or even a small load center (buss bar).
Junior Member
Squid
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 14
Your ground (green) wire looks like to light a gauge; it should be maybe at most one size down from the hot (red) and also go direct to the battery. The OE hot (red/white) should be snipped off or better, used to power an auxiliary circuit like a second rear brake light (with a new in-line fuse). The OE ground can be used for the negative for the same auxiliary circuit.
Note the OE hot & ground in photo 10 in the background. Since its a DC circuit the OE red/white can back-feed from the main fuse instead of feed in. Easy way to supply another circuit or even a small load center (buss bar).
Note the OE hot & ground in photo 10 in the background. Since its a DC circuit the OE red/white can back-feed from the main fuse instead of feed in. Easy way to supply another circuit or even a small load center (buss bar).
Crankenfine - thanks for the offer but I couldn't wait to get everything together.
Thanks to all for the informative thread and helpful feedback!
