General Discussion Anything SuperHawk Related

100 octane or 91?

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Old Jun 14, 2013 | 06:59 PM
  #31  
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I have always run 91 octane plus because thats the only way to get it around here without ethanol. Ethanol is evil to you carbs!
Old Jun 14, 2013 | 07:26 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Saintsman27
Seen all that has been said .. the lowest octane fuel we can get in the UK is
95 ... and super at 97 all is much the same.. unleaded gas of course.
There is no difference in performance I can measure in my VTR firestorm
in any fuel..
Alb
the octane ratings are calculated differently in NA compared to Europe. Ours is the R+M/2 method (R = reserarch, M = mechanical). I think ratings semantics aside, the "true" octane ratings (as a resistance to detonation) are very close (ie. our 87 would be close to your 95, or whatever your "regular" is rated at).....
Old Jun 14, 2013 | 07:30 PM
  #33  
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Some years ago, someone did a dyno test on a snowmobile engine (carbureted, liquid-cooled two stroke 700cc twin) that was rated for 87 octane. Switching to 91 octane (no changes made) resulted in a 2 hp loss........ again, it is generally recommended that one use the lowest octane rating that will maintain detonation protection, and get the best performance (and cheapest operating cost).....
Old Jun 15, 2013 | 12:07 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Saintsman27
Seen all that has been said .. the lowest octane fuel we can get in the UK is
95 ... and super at 97 all is much the same.. unleaded gas of course.
There is no difference in performance I can measure in my VTR firestorm
in any fuel..
Alb
Originally Posted by mikstr
the octane ratings are calculated differently in NA compared to Europe. Ours is the R+M/2 method (R = reserarch, M = mechanical). I think ratings semantics aside, the "true" octane ratings (as a resistance to detonation) are very close (ie. our 87 would be close to your 95, or whatever your "regular" is rated at).....
Actually, the European 95 RON ratied fuel is actually equivalent to the US 90.7 AKI rating for octane content... But in Europe it's almost always 5% Ethanol content (95 e5), altough 10% variations are popping up... But so far the "premium" 98, is still 5%, so running that might have advantages...
Old Jun 15, 2013 | 05:41 AM
  #35  
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here is another article on gas but this time as it pertains to motorcycles.
they refrence a katana for a lot of it and talk of compression ratios.
Katana is 600cc with a compression of 11.3:1 ~65HP said to be a de-tuned gsxr motor.
As most here will know
VTR is compression of 9.4:1 HP ~ 103HP

Understand Motorcycles & Fuel Octane Numbers
Old Jun 15, 2013 | 07:18 PM
  #36  
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I remember reading 4 cylinder engines are less likely to ping due to smaller pistons for a given cc compared to a twin or single.
Old Jun 16, 2013 | 06:24 PM
  #37  
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Looking at sticker on bike it reads Gasoline 91 RON

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Old Jun 16, 2013 | 07:04 PM
  #38  
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Which is 86 octane in US I do believe.
Old Jun 16, 2013 | 07:16 PM
  #39  
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Sticker under the seat reads Gasoline 91 ron.
Reading on wikipedia it says that MON is always lower then RON, so 87 R+M/2= will always have a 91 or greater ron rating (see wiki for table).

Ethonal will not hurt your hawk!
from the owners manual (pg 36)
Petrol containting Alcohol
if you decide to use a petro containng alcohol (gasohol), be sure it's octane rating is at least as high as that recommended by Honda. There are two types of "gasohol". one containng ethanol, and the other containing methanol. Do not use petrol that contains more then 10% ethanol. Do not use petrol containing methanol (methyl or wood alcohol) that does not also contain cosolvents and corrosion inhibitors for methalon. Never use perol containing more then 5% methanol, even if it has cosalvents and corrosion inhibitors


So ya Honda says 87 (usa, canada) is what is needed!
Ps. I'm still running 91..

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Old Jun 16, 2013 | 10:58 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Appletonhawk
I have always run 91 octane plus because thats the only way to get it around here without ethanol. Ethanol is evil to you carbs!
I frequently do the same. Just don't trust the ethanol. Not because it will damage the engine, it won't. My bike has to sit for 2+ months at a time without being ridden. I use Stabil but I think it works best with no ethanol fuel.

I have a Yamaha 2stroke outboard and the carbs are really sensitive to fuel sitting in them. So I use the no ethanol fuel in them. Most of the marinas in my area have no ethanol gas and there are several local gas stations that at least have no E premium. Anyway, the outboard cautions have spread to the bikes.
Old Jul 8, 2013 | 03:32 PM
  #41  
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I just switched from running 91 to 87 Octane and the seat of the pants dyno says that the bike is running smoother and the math says better gas mileage without a change in riding style...up until now I was a firm believer of only 91 in bikes but now I have to say 87 works better for me....Now the next change is to a OEM style filter from a K&N, but that's another thread
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 12:17 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by KCCO
I just switched from running 91 to 87 Octane and the seat of the pants dyno says that the bike is running smoother and the math says better gas mileage without a change in riding style...up until now I was a firm believer of only 91 in bikes but now I have to say 87 works better for me....Now the next change is to a OEM style filter from a K&N, but that's another thread
How long have you been running since you made the switch? I always heard that a motor can become "conditioned" to running a certain octane and then run like crap if it isn't getting that level. Maybe that was before the ethanol came into play, maybe I'm just a gullible ******** ......either way, I'm interested to know. Thanks.
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 01:08 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by drewski
How long have you been running since you made the switch? I always heard that a motor can become "conditioned" to running a certain octane and then run like crap if it isn't getting that level. Maybe that was before the ethanol came into play, maybe I'm just a gullible ******** ......either way, I'm interested to know. Thanks.
Well... Apples and oranges... A carb'ed engine has no memory what-so-ever...

A fully computerised engine with FI though, has a memory, and does indeed run like crap in the exact sitiation you describe, since it's sensors and adjustability is lagging behind, and all set for higher octane...
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 01:51 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Tweety
Well... Apples and oranges... A carb'ed engine has no memory what-so-ever...

A fully computerised engine with FI though, has a memory, and does indeed run like crap in the exact sitiation you describe, since it's sensors and adjustability is lagging behind, and all set for higher octane...
Good point, thanks. Never thought of it like that...
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 05:46 AM
  #45  
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I have run my hawk in 100LL for months and let me say my hawk loves it. I do feel the difference in performance when ran with lower. However now I don't have access to 100LL so now I run 93 .
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 05:59 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by mikstr
Some years ago, someone did a dyno test on a snowmobile engine (carbureted, liquid-cooled two stroke 700cc twin) that was rated for 87 octane. Switching to 91 octane (no changes made) resulted in a 2 hp loss........ again, it is generally recommended that one use the lowest octane rating that will maintain detonation protection, and get the best performance (and cheapest operating cost).....
This pretty much sums it up. Thank you mikstr.
Now move along, nothing else to see here.
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 09:37 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by drewski
How long have you been running since you made the switch? I always heard that a motor can become "conditioned" to running a certain octane and then run like crap if it isn't getting that level. Maybe that was before the ethanol came into play, maybe I'm just a gullible ******** ......either way, I'm interested to know. Thanks.
Two tanks fulls, like I said no firm data, just the seat-o-pants dyno.
Old Jul 9, 2013 | 10:32 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by jerzpilot
I have run my hawk in 100LL for months and let me say my hawk loves it. I do feel the difference in performance when ran with lower. However now I don't have access to 100LL so now I run 93 .
Some people should probably read the ENTIRE THREAD before posting... Makes them look less ignorant...
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