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I thought this would never happen to my hawk, guess I was wrong...

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I thought this would never happen to my hawk, guess I was wrong...

Old 03-11-2007, 10:51 PM
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Unhappy I thought this would never happen to my hawk, guess I was wrong...

Hi all,

After sitting inside my garage for about 3 month, today I finally got a chance to take her out for a ride. I came back home with a big question mark on my face, what the hell is happening to my hawk? The engine died 3 times in a 20 min ride. It was like a sudden death, no warnings or anything, almost like someone turns the key off or some kind of cut-off switch got activated.

First time: I was cruising at normal speed in higher gear and I downshifted to 1st when I came to a stop sign. Got the bike going again in 1st and pulled in the clutch ready to shift to 2nd and all of a sudden it just died. I was able to restart it again.
Second time: I was driving normally in 2nd around 20-30 mph on a tiny street pulled in the clutch and the bike died as soon as I downshifted to 1st. Just died, like the key got turned off. I was able to restart it again while the bike was rolling with clutch pulled in in 1st.
Note that I gunned it pretty hard before I pulled to the tiny street.

Third time: This was on my driveway. I started the bike, hopped on it, put it in first, drove it to my garage, parked it and it died while on idle. Again I was able to restart it right away.

I have no clue what is wrong with the bike, it's never happened before (I rode it all summer last year, 0 problems) until after the winter, after I restarted it today.

I've seen many people posted here with same type of issues / symptoms but I thought this would never happen to me, guess I was wrong...

Could this be a bad rectifier, bad rear ignition coil, bad carb, bad battery terminals, or maybe I put too much gas in the tank before I put it in storage, or maybe the gas has gone old and I need some new fresh gas?

Any answers on this problem will be greatly appreciated, thanks!!

Mike
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Old 03-11-2007, 11:29 PM
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Sounds like a bad rectifier. Something similar to the symptoms you describe happened to me on my F3.
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Old 03-12-2007, 03:58 AM
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Is this going around? I was out the other day. It got up to 78 here and me and the wife went to get something to eat. So we loaded up. the ride is about 25 min. all was good the hole way up there. Just on the return ride home i stop at a red light almost home (about 1mile away) it died. I was just siting there. It was not in gear. I was looking back talking to the wife and it just died. Its going to get about 78 so im going to let it sit and run to get hot to see if its going to do it once more. Most of the probs that i have seen on here are doing the same thing is doing it when the bike gets hot.
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Old 03-12-2007, 04:25 AM
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It's been sitting for 3 months, is the gas dead?
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Old 03-12-2007, 04:50 AM
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bad gas probably.
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Old 03-12-2007, 09:25 AM
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It doesn't take long for gas to go "bad"... My dual sport Suzuki never runs right after sitting for the winter even though I use stabil in it - just won't idle well. I normally take the gas out every spring and put in fresh and have had little problem since. My SH doesn't seem as fussy but gas could be a factor in your problem.
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Old 03-12-2007, 12:09 PM
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There is a lot of problems with the new gas and there additives. I would change the fuel in the tank and maybe run some dry gas thorugh.
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Old 03-12-2007, 02:51 PM
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I had this happen last year to my 98. I changed the battery and all has been fine since then. Try and charge the battery if it will not take a charge you have found the culprit.

Dennis
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Old 03-12-2007, 02:59 PM
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Doesn't sound like bad gas. Check the connections at your battery. Mine came loose after I put on the connecter for the Tender. It had zero juice. Went back out and it started right up. Sure seems like it must be something electrical. If it has only done it when hot, it could also be the RR.
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Old 03-12-2007, 05:02 PM
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Well i road to day about 80m. she ran good not a prob at all just like the good old days, Just must oh been some bad gas.
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Old 03-14-2007, 03:11 AM
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Thank you all for the help!!

I will check the battery terminals again and put in some fresh gas to see if the problem goes away. If not, it must be something electrical, like the rectifier or coils.

Thanks again for the help.

Mike
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:31 PM
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Say, I may have a similar issue. My bike had done it last season a few times, and then it did it again yesterday. I pulled in the clutch to downshift from either 3rd to 2nd or 2nd to first, and before I even pushed down the shifter, it died. This has to be electrical because my time and odometer were reset. It was like 50* out, and my bike was at around 200, maybe 205.

My theory is that they have still not mastered the recharge system. The stator moves very inconsistently compared to an inline 4-banger, and I think the R/R isn't managing the load well enough. The bike is hot, the revs get low, and then pulling in the clutch at the wrong time gives the stator charge a discordant resonance with the R/R, which makes it fritz out for a split sec. Then the plugs miss a fire, yadda yadda. Sound crazy? I dunno. Maybe the carbs had an imperfect amount of fuel too for running around 3 grand with a 1/4 to 1/2 throttle, at the border of multiple stages of jetting. It could be combination of factors. All I know is I checked all the connections, and they looked untouched to me, and I haven't had any problems in the last 200 miles.

So, I'm curious if other '03-'05's also had their odo and clocks zeroed, because I don't remember reading that amongst the complaints along these lines of others.
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Old 03-19-2007, 07:06 AM
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Hey all,
Mine was doing the same thing last summer. Replaced the battery a couple of times, cleaned the batt cables a bunch, but still the same thing. Then I changed the voltage regulator and presto! - all was good again, no problems since then. The Honda shop said it was pretty common for the regulators to go out. The replacement was $136 (ouch) from Honda (didn't shop around - my bad) but they said it was a better unit vs. the old one.
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Old 03-19-2007, 07:59 AM
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If it's not the regulator, it may be a torn diaphragm in the fuel petcock. I had to replace mine twice now (causes fuel starvation problem and stalling, not a good thing when you're passing an 18-wheeler on the highway!!!). Mine would cut out, then almost always fire up again. It would clear itself out and do again in a short while, very frustrating to diagnose the first time, now I know who it works. You can check it by removing the tank and petcock underneath, open it up and you'll see.

I used to run ethanol-enhanced gas when possible. I now think that the ethanol attacked the rubber diaphragm membrane (thought only menthanol was harmful to rubber but it seems that ethanol is too, although much less so) over time, weakening it and causing it to rupture.

Hope this helps.

cheers
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Old 03-19-2007, 10:54 AM
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before tearing the bike apart, try a little choke when warm, just pull it until it rev smooth, if it fix the problem, you are running lean, take 1/2 turn off the idle screw. I don't know the background of your bike, any jetting ?? The cold air is probably the culprit, you may also experience some carb freezing, if the temp is around 2 degree and loaded with moisture, it's quite possible.
I'm backing up all of the above as other possibilities, just adding this as easy to overlook.
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Old 03-19-2007, 12:57 PM
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Our carbs are heated so there shouldn't be any carb freezing going on. That's what those coolant lines are going to the carbs.
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Old 03-19-2007, 06:02 PM
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heated carbs ??, darn I missed that, it was quite cold when I teared mine apart, so I pretty much pulled everything in sight, well as a performance upgrade a cold carb would help quite a lot. Time to go back to my PDF's .
Edit: found them, it's all green inside, well I guess it rules out the carb freezing, but it brings out a good idea, why not a ball valve to take some heat out of the carbs during summer, even if it looks like a small amount of heat, it would be really cheap horsepower, denser intake charge, mmmm yummy
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Old 03-19-2007, 06:46 PM
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Won't make a difference. Here you go, sir:

https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...dyno#post40831
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:29 AM
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Smile

Guess what, it was due to a loose battery terminal!! Hard to believe a little loose battery terminal would do that!! Or maybe I was just lucky because the bike only had 3500 miles on the clock, not old enough for parts to go bad yet?

After the last time I posted here and before I went out for work, I was checking the battery and guess what, the positive terminal was semi-loose (meaning I could twist it around with a couple of my fingers). I don't know how did it get loose but the problem went away completely after I re-tightened the screw.

Later on that day I was out riding with my buddies for about 3 hours, stop-and-go tracfic, highway, and some back roads. The bike was as healthy as a horse and the sudden death thing did not even happen once.

Thanks again for all the info you guys shared with me.

Mike
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Old 03-20-2007, 05:04 AM
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Glad to hear that, well happy riding, more crappy weather here for us, but we'll get there soon enough.
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Old 03-20-2007, 05:23 AM
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I had the same problem on my FZ600, it would quit consistently after 20 minutes. Put a volt meter on the battery and run the bike. It should be charging at >12V. Mine was fine at start up and 20 minutes later the charge stopped and the bike ran down on the battery. It was a craked brush that the resistence got worse across as the temperature increased. Electrical gremlins are a pain in the ***, but a good volt meter and patience might save you time and money. Hope this helps.
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Old 06-01-2008, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Scooberhawk View Post
Say, I may have a similar issue. My bike had done it last season a few times, and then it did it again yesterday. I pulled in the clutch to downshift from either 3rd to 2nd or 2nd to first, and before I even pushed down the shifter, it died. This has to be electrical because my time and odometer were reset. It was like 50* out, and my bike was at around 200, maybe 205.

My theory is that they have still not mastered the recharge system. The stator moves very inconsistently compared to an inline 4-banger, and I think the R/R isn't managing the load well enough. The bike is hot, the revs get low, and then pulling in the clutch at the wrong time gives the stator charge a discordant resonance with the R/R, which makes it fritz out for a split sec. Then the plugs miss a fire, yadda yadda. Sound crazy? I dunno. Maybe the carbs had an imperfect amount of fuel too for running around 3 grand with a 1/4 to 1/2 throttle, at the border of multiple stages of jetting. It could be combination of factors. All I know is I checked all the connections, and they looked untouched to me, and I haven't had any problems in the last 200 miles.

So, I'm curious if other '03-'05's also had their odo and clocks zeroed, because I don't remember reading that amongst the complaints along these lines of others.
I had to resurrect this thread because on my '02 SH I'm having exactly the same issue. Once in a while the bike dies on me after downshifting to 1st. When I try to fire it up again the ODO and clock reset and the starter barely manages to turn the crank. The interesting thing is that I also get a misfire here and there and I am sure the problems are related.

Today I ran some tests and I found out that the battery is good but I have a 1.6mA current leakage which is coming from the ODOmeter circuit.
The R/R put's out about 12V at 5K rpm and 12.6V at idle. It looks like it's undercharging.
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Old 06-01-2008, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Killemall View Post
The R/R put's out about 12V at 5K rpm and 12.6V at idle. It looks like it's undercharging.
My '03 shows 14.4V at idle and 13.8V at revs, from battery terminals. Your voltages are way off normal range.
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Old 06-02-2008, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by VTR_kuski View Post
My '03 shows 14.4V at idle and 13.8V at revs, from battery terminals. Your voltages are way off normal range.
Yeah it looks like it may be the R/R indeed. But what the hell, my bike has the finned beefy R/R that Honda installed after 2000. I thought these don't fail.
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Old 06-02-2008, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Killemall View Post
Yeah it looks like it may be the R/R indeed. But what the hell, my bike has the finned beefy R/R that Honda installed after 2000. I thought these don't fail.
Less prone to, yes.. no part is perfect though, even Yamaha ones die occasionally.
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Old 06-02-2008, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by The Hawk Guy View Post
Guess what, it was due to a loose battery terminal!! Hard to believe a little loose battery terminal would do that!!
I'm suprised you didn't notice your gauges and needles swinging to zero and back. Mine had a loose connection and I found out when I was riding and saw my gauges doing their own thing . Turned out BOTH of my terminals were loose as can be . Tightened them down for now. Might need some blue loctite due to the vtwin vibrations I suppose.
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Old 06-02-2008, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by mikstr View Post
If it's not the regulator, it may be a torn diaphragm in the fuel petcock. I had to replace mine twice now (causes fuel starvation problem and stalling, not a good thing when you're passing an 18-wheeler on the highway!!!). Mine would cut out, then almost always fire up again. It would clear itself out and do again in a short while, very frustrating to diagnose the first time, now I know who it works. You can check it by removing the tank and petcock underneath, open it up and you'll see.

I used to run ethanol-enhanced gas when possible. I now think that the ethanol attacked the rubber diaphragm membrane (thought only menthanol was harmful to rubber but it seems that ethanol is too, although much less so) over time, weakening it and causing it to rupture.

Hope this helps.

cheers
Unless I'm very mistaken (which is always a possibility), the vacuum petcock's rubber diaphram should not actually come in contact with the fuel. The plastic plate riveted to the rubber has a "tit" that blocks fuel flow until the rubber diaphram retracts it under vacuum. If you are having trouble with torn diaphrams (too many jokes can be made here), then either too much diaphram movement is being permitted due to a weak closing spring and the material is failing due to fatigue, the "tit" is worn and allowed fuel to contact the rubber, or you are just unlucky with rubber (had to do it).
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Old 06-04-2008, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Killemall View Post
I had to resurrect this thread because on my '02 SH I'm having exactly the same issue. Once in a while the bike dies on me after downshifting to 1st. When I try to fire it up again the ODO and clock reset and the starter barely manages to turn the crank. The interesting thing is that I also get a misfire here and there and I am sure the problems are related.

Today I ran some tests and I found out that the battery is good but I have a 1.6mA current leakage which is coming from the ODOmeter circuit.
The R/R put's out about 12V at 5K rpm and 12.6V at idle. It looks like it's undercharging.
Before you go buying parts take time to check both positive and negetive battery connections. Not just at the battery but down stream also. The ODO and clock reset because of no voltage not low voltage. Good luck and let us know what you find.
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Old 06-04-2008, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Hawknut View Post
Before you go buying parts take time to check both positive and negetive battery connections. Not just at the battery but down stream also. The ODO and clock reset because of no voltage not low voltage. Good luck and let us know what you find.
Thanks for the advice, man. I'm going to run a few more checks with the MM when I'll take it apart this weekend. My theory is that the ODO and the clock reset because when I fire it up, the starter motor draws a massive amount of current and cuts off the other circuits. That includes the one for the ODO and clock which probably need a constant current supply of ~1.6mA to stay on all the time. If the starter motor is starving for current then I think that's caused by an undercharged battery, which again points to a bad R/R.

Well, in the end I have already bought a new R1 R/R on ebay for cheap. If it doesn't fix the problem it will be up for sale in the classifieds.
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