Wheels forks and swingarms.
Thread Starter
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Squid
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 80
Wheels forks and swingarms.
Guys I appreciate all the great advice and patience. I have started to tear down my '98 Hawk for a front to back rebuild. I am concentrating on paint and suspension mainly, but am also looking at undertail etc.
My question here is about trying to find some lighter better wheels in addition to my front suspension upgrades and swingarm upgrades. I am kinda set on doing the 1000rr front end and utilizing the 1000rr front wheel. I am figuring I can buy an entire front end ( forks, tripples, brakes, wheels, etc. ) all together cheeper than buying stuff here and there. I am led to believe that the 1000rr wheels are significantly lighter than the stock vtr wheels and will be a major advantage in reducing unsprung weight. My hangup is that I dont care to have mismatched wheels front and back. I am at the swingarm stage at the moment. Will the 1000rr rear wheel be able to be used with the stock swingarm? If not can it be used with the rc51 sp2 swingarm? I have noticed from a few rc51 sp2 mods, that there seems to be some new ideas etc. What would be the best way to do the rc51 sp2 conversion?
I know much of this has been covered in the past, but honestly I sit up til late at night searching through threads and trying to retain everything, but at points it all seems to melt together. I know by the end of this build I should be ever grateful to alot of people and also able to share my experiences and knowledge with others.
Thanks again, Walt
My question here is about trying to find some lighter better wheels in addition to my front suspension upgrades and swingarm upgrades. I am kinda set on doing the 1000rr front end and utilizing the 1000rr front wheel. I am figuring I can buy an entire front end ( forks, tripples, brakes, wheels, etc. ) all together cheeper than buying stuff here and there. I am led to believe that the 1000rr wheels are significantly lighter than the stock vtr wheels and will be a major advantage in reducing unsprung weight. My hangup is that I dont care to have mismatched wheels front and back. I am at the swingarm stage at the moment. Will the 1000rr rear wheel be able to be used with the stock swingarm? If not can it be used with the rc51 sp2 swingarm? I have noticed from a few rc51 sp2 mods, that there seems to be some new ideas etc. What would be the best way to do the rc51 sp2 conversion?
I know much of this has been covered in the past, but honestly I sit up til late at night searching through threads and trying to retain everything, but at points it all seems to melt together. I know by the end of this build I should be ever grateful to alot of people and also able to share my experiences and knowledge with others.
Thanks again, Walt
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MotoGP
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,942
From: Lake View Terrace, CA
Well a 1000rr wheel can be made to work with the stock swingarm, if you are going to that much trouble it would be better to swap in the SP2 swingarm IMHO.
As for how to do it, well talk to Tweety or do a search, it's all pretty well documented.
As for how to do it, well talk to Tweety or do a search, it's all pretty well documented.
Thread Starter
Member
Squid
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 80
Ya Hawk I know I have read through different peoples rc51 swingarm builds. I personally dont have the tooling atm or the time to do it in house, so I am having to rely on the talents of others. I have been in contact with Andrew about the swingarm when he is ready to take on some projects. He and I talked about doing the 900rr brace mod, but I may be better of it seems going the rc51 route to utilize the 1000rr rear wheel. If he is game I just might have them both done. There was the person here with the marchesni wheels advertized for sale. I know I didnt spell that right...lol...But I messaged them about the wheels and havnt heard back. If I went that route, the stock swingarm should be fine. I would then have to figure out fitting them to the 1000rr front end.
I appreciate your constant input Hawk.
Cheers, Walt
I appreciate your constant input Hawk.
Cheers, Walt
Banned
MotoGP
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,942
From: Lake View Terrace, CA
Wish I could help out more but I haven't swapped out my swingarm, just braced it. So I can't give you any details on how to do it myself.
You will need to get a link of some kind made. If you have no other options, I know the drawing is posted here somewhere, find that and contact our good old "Dr. Honda" to see what he would charge you to make what you need.
You will need to get a link of some kind made. If you have no other options, I know the drawing is posted here somewhere, find that and contact our good old "Dr. Honda" to see what he would charge you to make what you need.
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
FYI the 1000RR front wheel is actually not that different from the stocker in looks, with the main difference being a hole at the end of each spoke in the 1000RR. (IIRC, I can double check when I get home as I am running mismatched)
It is far closer in looks to the stock rear than a 954 front wheel that was my other option.
It is far closer in looks to the stock rear than a 954 front wheel that was my other option.
Thread Starter
Member
Squid
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 80
Thanks Lazn. Ya I looked at perhaps buying a '09 1000rr repsol a local dealer had. I recal what you are saying about the rims now. I found the holes kinda odd, but he was talking up how much weight they reduced. I decided instead of spending some serious cash and having a monthly payment, I would rather spend a bit of cash and have a very nice superhawk. Quite frankly I really feel I have stumbled upon alot of really cool people that are very enthusiastic about their bikes. I am not going to pursue racing anymore, but when the curvies are there I am going to slide down and carve them to the best of my abilities. I firmly believe that with the front and rear mods I can have one very nice super street bike fully capable of participating in the spirited rides in my area.
2nd mouse gets the cheese
SuperBike
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,697
From: Beaverton, OR
also to answer my curiosity, what is involved to make a 1000rr rear wheel fit a stock swing arm?
The reason I am wondering is that if you do that then you can keep stock bike geometry and shock linkage and shock and you can just have someone like me build a a brace. In the end it is less destructive in terms of bikes off of the road and potentially could be just as functional and cool. That is depending on how much is involved in putting a 1000rr wheel on a hawk.
Andrew
The reason I am wondering is that if you do that then you can keep stock bike geometry and shock linkage and shock and you can just have someone like me build a a brace. In the end it is less destructive in terms of bikes off of the road and potentially could be just as functional and cool. That is depending on how much is involved in putting a 1000rr wheel on a hawk.
Andrew
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 360
From: Florida panhandle
It's a 6" wide wheel i think is the biggest problem. Pretty sure different spacers would have to be machined for it to fit the stock swingarm. There are so many threads on this that even date back to 2005 and none with a clear dead set answer lol
...
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Well... You could... Or I could give you the answer...
It's a 6" rim, so it affects handling... It's also wider at the axle than the stock wheel, to the point where it's barely possible to get it inside the stock swingarm, spacers will be a bitch... It needs to have the 25mm bearings including an odd sized one swapped out... The alignment of the sprockets are way of if you use the stock swing...
Net result... PITA...
The reason I matched it with a SP2 swingarm is pretty simple... The wider rim makes the bike more "lazy" already... Add a bit longer stance with the swingarm and it gets worse... Then you raise the rear, no problem for me since I'm a tall guy and have the slightly shorter CBR 1000RR forks and you get a pretty agressive stance...
It's rock solid, holds a line much better than stock, needs a firm input to start turning, but you can place it/flick it with a speed and accuracy that's downright scary compared to stock... It's not quite as novice friendly as it was stock, but I can run circles around a stock VTR...
My advice, swap in a swingarm from an SP1 or SP2 and stick the CBR wheel in that... It's a much better option than trying to manhandle it into the stock swing...
Corn, there are measurements floating around here in threads that I provided for the geometry of the "dogbone" to make an SP1/2 swing fit as bolt on... I'm fairly certain you have the tools and know-how to make that part... Then two bearings and a spacer for the pivot if trident wants the shorter SP1 swing or just bolt the SP2 in there untouched...
It's a 6" rim, so it affects handling... It's also wider at the axle than the stock wheel, to the point where it's barely possible to get it inside the stock swingarm, spacers will be a bitch... It needs to have the 25mm bearings including an odd sized one swapped out... The alignment of the sprockets are way of if you use the stock swing...
Net result... PITA...
The reason I matched it with a SP2 swingarm is pretty simple... The wider rim makes the bike more "lazy" already... Add a bit longer stance with the swingarm and it gets worse... Then you raise the rear, no problem for me since I'm a tall guy and have the slightly shorter CBR 1000RR forks and you get a pretty agressive stance...
It's rock solid, holds a line much better than stock, needs a firm input to start turning, but you can place it/flick it with a speed and accuracy that's downright scary compared to stock... It's not quite as novice friendly as it was stock, but I can run circles around a stock VTR...
My advice, swap in a swingarm from an SP1 or SP2 and stick the CBR wheel in that... It's a much better option than trying to manhandle it into the stock swing...
Corn, there are measurements floating around here in threads that I provided for the geometry of the "dogbone" to make an SP1/2 swing fit as bolt on... I'm fairly certain you have the tools and know-how to make that part... Then two bearings and a spacer for the pivot if trident wants the shorter SP1 swing or just bolt the SP2 in there untouched...
2nd mouse gets the cheese
SuperBike
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,697
From: Beaverton, OR
good info there tweety.
for me I was planning on just building a brace for my stock swing arm and calling it a day. I think most people on the forum could benefit from a modification like this more then a swing arm swap considering it is a pull it off modify and put back on operation that won't affect geometry and handling in a way that has to be addresses multiple ways like the swaps do. M..aybe in the long run a swap has better results for extremely hard riding, but most of us have a ways before we get there and could benefit from just a brace for a good while. If I need/want to go any faster I will probably buy a track bike and do it that way. It should be obvious a stock super is already fast enough for me for a while
.
for me I was planning on just building a brace for my stock swing arm and calling it a day. I think most people on the forum could benefit from a modification like this more then a swing arm swap considering it is a pull it off modify and put back on operation that won't affect geometry and handling in a way that has to be addresses multiple ways like the swaps do. M..aybe in the long run a swap has better results for extremely hard riding, but most of us have a ways before we get there and could benefit from just a brace for a good while. If I need/want to go any faster I will probably buy a track bike and do it that way. It should be obvious a stock super is already fast enough for me for a while
.
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 344
Awesome Tweety. You answered my 1000rr rear wheel/SP2 swingarm question.
Anyone know the differences between a CBR 600rr and 1000rr rear wheels (weight, size, etc)?
Anyone know the differences between a CBR 600rr and 1000rr rear wheels (weight, size, etc)?
Last edited by salmanilla2000; Jan 12, 2011 at 11:38 AM.
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
BTW, to add to the above since I read my own post and found the text a bit unclear...
The wider rim and longer swingarm makes the bike lazier, more stable... The higher rear end compensates, so does the shorter fork with more flickable steering... End result, you get more stability from the long wheelbase, but the resulting steering is still quick, with good flickability... Needs a firm input to start the turn, but holds the line very nicely...
Senior Member
SuperSport
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 636
From: Baltimore, Maryland
Tweety, how do you think the shorter SP1 swingarm would handle, with the CBR1000 front end set up, compared to the longer one? I'm trying to decide which route to go for my rear setup. I plan to ride on the track more than a few times.
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