smokinjoe73

So yes I thought of the connectors since the one on the old solenoid was white and powdery (thought I found the issue)

So my next step is to clean all connectors and I guess check grounds.

E.Marquez

dont forget the clutch interlock switch in the diag...
If you have piece of 14ga wire and a normally open push button switch plus two med sized alligator clips.. make a quick starter bypass switch.. (EDIT. you can buy one for $10 as well https://www.amazon.com/INNOVA-3630-R...starter+switch

Remember, that is only to trigger the relay,, it is not designed for high amperage of bypassing the relay... though there are those type of remote starter switches as well..just moree $$$$)

when the issue happens, with leads to battery positive and then relay trigger terminal, key on..push button, if it cranks and starts, A : your not stuck someplace and B: you just helped confirm your Diag, and now get to start hunting down the open circuit

smokinjoe73

Thanks Erik, but first, diag is diagram?

And to be clear you mean jumping right from positive battery lead to the relay wire coming off the relay?

VTR1000F

Diagnosis.

E.Marquez

Sorry.. DIAG= Diagnosis.

The starter relay has 4 terminals, two large, two small.
The two large are primary power in, then primary power out (full battery power and amperage capable, LARGE wires)
the two small terminals are ground and trigger...the trigger is a low amp source from the starter button..that triggers (closes) the starter relay ..
The problem is, on the relay, both the ground circuit and the 12v trigger circuit could have opens.

The ground side of the relay comes by way of the clutch safety switch.. if that switch or its wiring failed, the starter relay gets no ground..
The 12v trigger side of the relay comes by way of the starter button.
the relay trigger and ground terminals are enclosed in the relay housing and the plug.. you would need to remove the plug to access the terminals.
Or you can back pin them with a needle probe if you have that.
A neat tool for doing diagnosis on an issue like this is a power probe. as with the flip of a switch it can provide a ground path or 12v..makes testing relays, light circuits, switches ect very easy.
if this is all greek to you, I can take a pic or 10 and show you what i mean...

smokinjoe73

Thanks, that will give me some digging to do.

Is the clutch safety switch bypassable easily, like at the clutch lever, or are there too many other places it could fail. Meaning can I just connect the wires at the clutch lever to remove that as possible issue? (nevermind the safety thing of doing that)

Today I unplugged, clean then replugged with dielectric grease many connectors including ecu, black box, starter button connector, etc.

Problem remains but will keep checking stuff.

Oh and by each side of the relay having possible opens, do you mean putting 12 volts to it with a temp starter button may not make the bike turn over?

smokinjoe73

Been reading online, there is a ton written about similar problems but on one thread someone swore it was the RR.

I just replaced mine but also have 2 voltmeters so am pretty sure if it was on the blink I would know.

Besides, a bad rr tends to leave you with a dead battery, but mine is really strong.

Just thinking out loud. (or in print).

VTR1000F

Are you in neutral when trying to start? If you're in neutral, I believe this takes the clutch switch out of the circuit (bypasses it). If not, then isn't the side stand switch also in the circuit with the clutch switch? i.e.: if not in neutral, then you must pull the clutch in and have the side stand up to start.

E.Marquez

Is the clutch safety switch bypassable easily, like at the clutch lever,

Yes, its two terminals, a jumper wire in the two terminals on wiring harness side will bypass the switch.

or are there too many other places it could fail.
Sure, wiring anywhere along the \way ...could be an open (broken wire)
Meaning can I just connect the wires at the clutch lever to remove that as possible issue? (nevermind the safety thing of doing that)
Yes

Oh and by each side of the relay having possible opens, do you mean putting 12 volts to it with a temp starter button may not make the bike turn over?

Both sides of the relay... as in the hot trigger power coming in from the starter button ..that circuit could be faulty...an open , or a short.
Or the ground side of the relay that ground path comes to the relay by way of the safety switch...so the switch could be bad, or an open on the circuit (broken wire, bad connection)

You really need a digital volt meter to test with, and you need it with you, so you can test when the fault happens.
A test light could mostly do the job as well,,,better a test light that has voltage reading as well.

Better yet would be a Power Probe 3 as then you can do it all with providing a gound path, or 12vdc, and read voltage

smokinjoe73

So Erik I am staring at the wiring diagram, and it looks like green/red (wire) and yellow/red is the switched wire so if I jump 12v to one of themwith my test button that should trigger the relay to spin the starter yes?

Or do I use the push button to ground one of them?

E.Marquez

What year do you have? there is a difference in wiring early to late

E.Marquez

Yellow / red is the wire you want to jump 12v to..that should cause the relay to close providing power to the starter.

The green / red wire is ground....if you test and have 12V at the yellow red wire when you push the starter button or jump 12v to it.. then check for a ground on the green / red wire.... if it is testing as open, jump it to ground.

smokinjoe73

Wow ok perfect thanks.

My bike is 98 but the motor is 05. Everything is wired the same as 98 since I did the motor swap in my garage a few years ago.

Will mess with it tomorrow. Put on a new starter button today. Also put a really nice jumper on that pesky clutch switch

Updates tomorrow.

Cadbury64