Race tech or frontal swap??
11-20-2007, 03:28 PM
#1
Senior Member
MotoGP
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: NYC
Posts: 5,033
Race tech or frontal swap??
Hey Superhawkers, I am an avid rider & roadracer, but this age old question is for my SH streetbike. It now has stock front stuff but I want an upgrade. Should I go with gold valves & springs or a 929/954 etc front swap. It seems I could recoup some cost selling the stock front, but how much headache is involved? Will I notice better handling with the race tech? Could I ask any more questions? I would appreciate any insight.
11-20-2007, 04:02 PM
#2
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: MN
Posts: 1,548
do the swap - its another leap beyond in terms of less flex and genuine adjustability, better brakes by far and lighter wheel. if u're patient on ebay you can get good prices and recoup a lot. I think the rc 51 is simple but there are lots options. to me the swap and a good rear shock really transform the bike
11-20-2007, 05:01 PM
#3
Senior Member
Superstock
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 387
I'm in the midst of my 954 swap...cost of new stuff around 700. Money back from old stuff 450 so far but my "old stuff" included a new Coerce brace and RT springs and Helis...YMMV. Many hours invested in research, stress, ebaying, fitting, grinding, assembling, packing, shipping, etc.
I'll post the glorious results in a couple of weeks. My advice? Take your time, shop with patience...hear that? PATIENCE. Don't get into an Ebay frenzy...there will always be another whatever later.
I already had RC calipers/mc and RT Gold Valves that swap right over. Bought RT springs for the 954...that's another 100.
I'll post the glorious results in a couple of weeks. My advice? Take your time, shop with patience...hear that? PATIENCE. Don't get into an Ebay frenzy...there will always be another whatever later.
I already had RC calipers/mc and RT Gold Valves that swap right over. Bought RT springs for the 954...that's another 100.
11-21-2007, 06:56 AM
#6
Senior Member
Superstock
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 387
Springs are different in width and length so no swap there. I talked to the techies at RaceTech and explained my swap after noting that the GoldValve kit number was the same for the SH and the 954 forks. He said they called for the same kit and actually the same shim stack..C34 so I could just swap'em over. I have...and new springs should arrive today.
11-21-2007, 08:10 AM
#7
Senior Member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New Jersey USA
Posts: 284
Joe, I did the race tech valves and springs cost $400.00 I think. I also added a Penske shock $800.00. For what I need the bike to do its was more than worth it. Unless I was getting a super deal on another front end I wouldn't bother with all the B/S to upgrade. You can haggle with race tech and get up to 30% off their prices. Good luck
11-21-2007, 05:22 PM
#8
Member
Squid
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 68
Joe, I did the race tech valves and springs cost $400.00 I think. I also added a Penske shock $800.00. For what I need the bike to do its was more than worth it. Unless I was getting a super deal on another front end I wouldn't bother with all the B/S to upgrade. You can haggle with race tech and get up to 30% off their prices. Good luck
11-21-2007, 05:40 PM
#9
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: MN
Posts: 1,548
its not that much bs. and if your background is track and racing you will glad u went the extra effort. the benefit per cost is much higher. especially if you figure in a brake upgrade that comes with it. I can only say most of the skeptics haven't ridden one. I think greg used to be fairly skeptical, but read his after-swap thread riding impressions. my impressions are its worth the effort. for the rc51 front end its all rc parts with just a slight trim of the lower fairing edge to make room for the wider usd fork triples - everything else lines up pretty easily as I recall
bill
bill
Joe, I did the race tech valves and springs cost $400.00 I think. I also added a Penske shock $800.00. For what I need the bike to do its was more than worth it. Unless I was getting a super deal on another front end I wouldn't bother with all the B/S to upgrade. You can haggle with race tech and get up to 30% off their prices. Good luck
11-21-2007, 09:42 PM
#10
Administrator
World Champion
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Fulton, MO
Posts: 105,287
Yup, the improvement in braking performance alone was worth the swap. I went with 1000RR parts though, which utilize radial calipers and 310mm rotors.
The biggest headache is the clip-ons and getting the adjustability and clearance of the fairings. The rest is pretty easy. Trimming the lower triple stops is dirty and time consuming but not difficult at all.
As mentioned above, take your time collecting parts and be picky about quality like I was and it'll be worth it.
The biggest headache is the clip-ons and getting the adjustability and clearance of the fairings. The rest is pretty easy. Trimming the lower triple stops is dirty and time consuming but not difficult at all.
As mentioned above, take your time collecting parts and be picky about quality like I was and it'll be worth it.
11-22-2007, 08:10 AM
#11
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,802
I'll chime in with my two cents. I think many of us were skeptics before doing the swap, or at least not expecting the radical, noticeable improvements of the beefier front end, but the after swap consensus is that it's a no brainer; a Race Tech'd stock front end is no match for an upside down conversion. To me the transitional stability and stability under braking are much improved over the stock forks. The added braking power is just very nice icing on the cake.
I got $500 for my old forks with Race Tech springs, and I had about $750-800 in the 954 front end. A major improvement for $300.
Like Greg said, finding a workable solution for bars is the biggest headache. I ended up mounting clamps and a tubular superbike bar to the top 954 triple instead of using clip-ons.
I got $500 for my old forks with Race Tech springs, and I had about $750-800 in the 954 front end. A major improvement for $300.
Like Greg said, finding a workable solution for bars is the biggest headache. I ended up mounting clamps and a tubular superbike bar to the top 954 triple instead of using clip-ons.
11-22-2007, 09:23 PM
#13
Senior Member
MotoGP
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: NYC
Posts: 5,033
Thanks guys for all the input. It verifies my intuitive guess, BUT is the rc51 SUBSTANTIALLY more straght forward of a swap or am I correct in thinking that I should use the non gull wing triples?....?
11-23-2007, 08:24 AM
#14
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,802
RC51 forks are longer and are made to be used with the flat top triple. 954, 929, 1000RR forks are shorter and need the gull wing triples; if you use the flat top triple with the shorter forks from one of the CBRs the front ride height will be too low. RC parts are generally rarer and more expensive and the RC front wheel doesn't match the VTR rear like the others do. If you use the longer RC forks with the gull wing top triple then you can mount clip-ons above the top triple, making for a simpler, easier bar solution. Clipons or bars are generally more trouble with the gull wing triples because they need to be taller to clear the VTR body work and to get a reasonable bar height, otherwise the swap is the same for either front end. I believe TL1000 helibars have been used successfully with the gull wing triples. Others who have gone the clip-ons route can tell you what they used with success.
Last edited by killer5280; 11-23-2007 at 08:33 AM.
11-24-2007, 02:01 PM
#16
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,802
I don't know for certain. The 929 and 954 are identical. The RC51 triples are the same width, but the top one is flat and the bottom one is dropped, which is the opposite of the 929/954. The CBR1000RR triples are like the 929/954, but I'm not sure if they are the same width. I remember Greg saying the 1000RR's are wider, but I don't think it was ever determined definitively. I don't see how they would clear the VTR's fairing if they were any wider.
11-24-2007, 06:46 PM
#17
Senior Member
MotoGP
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gainesville FLA.
Posts: 3,844
11-24-2007, 09:21 PM
#18
Administrator
World Champion
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Fulton, MO
Posts: 105,287
The 1000RR forks with the 929/954 triples end up being 2mm narrower than the 1000RR forks with 1000RR triples. The margin of error there is not critical. Stock wheel, spacers, and axle worked perfectly. I just chose to shave 1mm off each spacer for consistency. I have an extra set of spacers so I may not even install them. I'll have to measure the fork stiction with both and I'll go with whichever has less.
Fairing clearance is decent with my current setup. I don't forsee any problems if you were to use 1000RR triples. The only problem with those triples though is that they are ugly...well the upper anyway. It's designed to work with the HESD and thus has tabs and bolt holes on it...hence my reasons for going with the 929/954.
Fairing clearance is decent with my current setup. I don't forsee any problems if you were to use 1000RR triples. The only problem with those triples though is that they are ugly...well the upper anyway. It's designed to work with the HESD and thus has tabs and bolt holes on it...hence my reasons for going with the 929/954.
11-25-2007, 01:07 AM
#19
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Skurup, Sweden
Posts: 6,109
Well, with a 2mm difference it's not really a space issue... Does the steering stem/bearings match up as well?
Also since I might get one with the stem (complete front on ebay) What would be needed to make the HESD fit to the bike except for the top triple?
Never mind... it needs input from the speed sensor... That's not going to happen to easily...
Also since I might get one with the stem (complete front on ebay) What would be needed to make the HESD fit to the bike except for the top triple?
Never mind... it needs input from the speed sensor... That's not going to happen to easily...
Last edited by Tweety; 11-25-2007 at 01:20 AM.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
