F4i brakes
02-06-2010, 11:02 PM
#1
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F4i brakes
I was thinking about getting some f4i calipers but wanted to run them with a radial master. will a new 1000rr master be ok? is the stroke to big? I ran across a link to one of the other vtr forums where a guy had made a spreadsheet with the different braking options and their calculated pressure ratios but now can't seem to find it. Do any of you who have done brake mods have any thoughts on this or what mc I should use for the f4i calipers?
02-07-2010, 04:55 AM
#4
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I am running 98 900RR calipers (same as F4i) and have it mated to a NIssin raidal MC from a 2006 ZX-6R (which I beleive is the same as CBRs and GSX-Rs) asnd the set-up is awesome. Stick some good pads in there and brace yourself!!!!!
02-07-2010, 02:10 PM
#7
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I got the calipers and they have ss lines on them, I'm now wondering what pads to put on them. I'm looking for good street brakes not race brakes that I have to warm up or anything, cheaper is better. Any ideas? Greg was that clearance issues with an otherwise stock set up? how much of clearance issues?
02-08-2010, 01:18 PM
#14
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I was thinking about getting some f4i calipers but wanted to run them with a radial master. will a new 1000rr master be ok? is the stroke to big? I ran across a link to one of the other vtr forums where a guy had made a spreadsheet with the different braking options and their calculated pressure ratios but now can't seem to find it. Do any of you who have done brake mods have any thoughts on this or what mc I should use for the f4i calipers?
I dont know what diameter the 1000rr master cylinder is, but if you look in one of my follow up replies there is some interesting data logging results from a UK bike magazine on the deceptive performance from a lager bore M/C.............deceptive in that the barkes felt stronger [as the lever feel was good] but teh stopping distance was longer!
Here is the link to the UK forum thread if you are interested.
http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=15494
if you know the bore of the 1000RR M/C I can update the spreadsheet, or you can look for the closest similar size
02-08-2010, 07:04 PM
#15
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It was me who did the spreadsheet, but I took all the sizes off the threads I found on this site
I dont know what diameter the 1000rr master cylinder is, but if you look in one of my follow up replies there is some interesting data logging results from a UK bike magazine on the deceptive performance from a lager bore M/C.............deceptive in that the barkes felt stronger [as the lever feel was good] but teh stopping distance was longer!
Here is the link to the UK forum thread if you are interested.
http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=15494
if you know the bore of the 1000RR M/C I can update the spreadsheet, or you can look for the closest similar size
I dont know what diameter the 1000rr master cylinder is, but if you look in one of my follow up replies there is some interesting data logging results from a UK bike magazine on the deceptive performance from a lager bore M/C.............deceptive in that the barkes felt stronger [as the lever feel was good] but teh stopping distance was longer!
Here is the link to the UK forum thread if you are interested.
http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=15494
if you know the bore of the 1000RR M/C I can update the spreadsheet, or you can look for the closest similar size
Kudos on the spreadsheet by the way, very good info to have at hand.
02-08-2010, 07:28 PM
#16
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yes but even more lever travel than stock. There's a sweet spot between feel and travel that's right for each person, stock mc with f4i brakes will give the most actual stopping power but you probably want less lever travel and a slightly firmer feel.
02-08-2010, 08:58 PM
#17
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I can also vouch for the stock F4i master cylinder doing the job.
Feel and stopping power is excellent.
It bolts up with no clearance issues.
Your brake lever will fit (especially handy if you have Pazzo's or similar).
Existing brake lines will fit if you have braided lines.
Pretty good option I reckon.
Feel and stopping power is excellent.
It bolts up with no clearance issues.
Your brake lever will fit (especially handy if you have Pazzo's or similar).
Existing brake lines will fit if you have braided lines.
Pretty good option I reckon.
02-08-2010, 10:30 PM
#18
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any body know anything about these MCs? I run an SP1 MC & f4i calipers but want more feel, an easier pull & eq power...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Front...item56308656c9
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Front...item56308656c9
02-09-2010, 04:23 AM
#19
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I dont know what the lever travel is with standard M/C and these calipers, for sure it will be longer than standard, but I dont know if it is still OK. I think there are people out there who have this set up, so perhaps they can comment.......for sure they will have the best hydraulic advantage so should have good stopping power, but perhaps less feel.
02-09-2010, 06:27 AM
#20
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Don`t forget when it comes to MC, piston diameter is NOT the only factor to consider, there is also the matter of leverage afforded by the pivot distance. This is why, for example, Brembo makes three radial MCs with 19 mm pistons, the 19x16, 19x18 and 19x20. The 16 gives the most leverage at the cost of increased lever travel whereas the 20 lies at the other extreme, with the shortest lever travel and least leverage. Having run a Nissin 19 mm radial MC (from a 2006 ZX-6R) with 900RR calipers (same as F4i), I can vouch that this set-up is significantly stronger than the SP2 MC I ran previously. I can now lock the front wheel at will,and am still using the stock 296 mm rotors. The only reason I can see for NOT goign to this set-up has to do with fitment issues. Trust me, if you can make it fit, you will NOT regret it!!!!!!!
02-09-2010, 06:28 AM
#21
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Skokie, I was wondering the same thing. I know there cheap korean or chinese brembo knock offs and I've heard the super cheap ones are crap but I don't know about the larger diameter more expensive ones. Supposedly the casting is better. I know there are a lot of things out there that have been stolen and then duplicated at low cost in asia that are ok and sometimes far superior products than the original (some of the Iclones are ridiculously awesome) but some of that stuff is total crap to.
02-09-2010, 06:46 AM
#22
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any body know anything about these MCs? I run an SP1 MC & f4i calipers but want more feel, an easier pull & eq power...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Front...item56308656c9
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Front...item56308656c9
02-09-2010, 09:39 AM
#23
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Don`t forget when it comes to MC, piston diameter is NOT the only factor to consider, there is also the matter of leverage afforded by the pivot distance. This is why, for example, Brembo makes three radial MCs with 19 mm pistons, the 19x16, 19x18 and 19x20. The 16 gives the most leverage at the cost of increased lever travel whereas the 20 lies at the other extreme, with the shortest lever travel and least leverage.!!
If i had good data on the lever ratios I was going to add that to the calculation so I could convert force exerted by your hand at a set point on the lever to caliper force exerted on the pads. ......... and I did think about showing the lever movement to displace the caliper pistons as well, but I remembered that I need to get a life!
and thanks for answering the question I didnt ask yet........"what does 19x20 mean?" I was wondering about that.
02-09-2010, 10:13 AM
#24
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In the expression 19x20, the first number refers to the piston size and I believe the second refers to the distance away from the fulcrum at which the pressure is applied (in mm?). So, a 19x16 would give you more mechanical advantage (but require greater travel) than a 19x20, for example. Brembo also make some that are 16x??, and this indicates a 16 mm piston.
Hope that helps
Hope that helps
02-09-2010, 11:20 AM
#25
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Thanks for bringing that up mikstr, I think I knew that in the back of my mind but had failed to actually think about it. Along the same line I think we need to take into account the difference in mechanical advantage due to rider hand position. I propose for easier math we assume a single point of contact and measure the distance from the middle finger to the pivot point and use that number ( does everyone use there middle finger to brake?). Once the SI spladle standard for measuring braking lever mechanical advantage is adopted it will all be much simpler. Also on a serious note more lever travel leads to a slower reaction time and this needs to be taken into account for total stopping distance, a tenth of a second at 60 mph is almost 9 feet
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