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520 Conversion, please explain

Old 03-12-2010, 02:30 AM
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520 Conversion, please explain

Ok, not sure if this question will make me a retard or not but here goes.....

I am looking at doing a sproket change as I want more "OMG hang on" boost from the hawk. I am planning to drop one tooth from the front and go up 2 on the rear. I thought this was what's known as the 520 conversion but have read some posts recently that indicate there may be more to it. Can someone please explain what else is involved??

Also, how hard is it to do yourself as apposed to having it done professionally??

I tried to do a search but it was not working very well and I could not find anythng in the Knowlege Base.
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Old 03-12-2010, 03:13 AM
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520 chain conversion is how thick the chain & sprockets are. 520 is thinner than 530. As a result you have a lighter sprocket, but lighter also means not as strong & will also wear out quicker.

It is easy to change the sprockets, they just bolt on & off.
The only hard part if you have never done it before would be to cut the chain to length.

here is a picture of the different thickness in the sprockets.

Hope this helps you out.
Attached Thumbnails 520 Conversion, please explain-frontsprockets.jpg  

Last edited by hondavtr1000sp2; 03-14-2010 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 03-12-2010, 03:26 AM
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But changing the amount of teeth on a sprocket is a completely different story & not called a 520 chain conversion.

You can change the number of teeth regardless of if you have 520 or 530 size chain & sprockets.

More or less teeth on the front & rear will give you more or less acceleration & also change your top speed.

Do a search on this forum & you will find plenty of infomation about how many teeth guys are running on there bikes, & the effects it has on the performance.

The below photo is of two front sprockets, the sprocket on the left has 15 teeth, the sprocket on the right has 17 teeth.
Attached Thumbnails 520 Conversion, please explain-left15toothright17frontsprockets.jpg  

Last edited by hondavtr1000sp2; 03-14-2010 at 06:12 PM.
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Old 03-12-2010, 03:44 AM
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Ok, some coherent thoughts for you. Everything HondaVTR1000SP2 said is correct, just sounds like ramble.

Got -1 +2 will give you a lot of OMG factor. If you search for 15/43 you will find plenty of discussion about it. That is the new tooth count.

The 520 conversion. That is changing the width of your chain and sprockets. Depending on who you talk to, the 520 is as strong as the 530. Where the excessive wear/replacement lies is, that most users choose to do an aluminum 520 sprocket to save on weight. The aluminum wears faster, so your replacing the pieces/parts more often.

A 520 conversion with steel sprockets should see the same type of life as the 530.

The reason for the 520 conversion? Less rotating mass. More horsepower/torque to the wheel.

You can do the 15/43 without doing the 520, and vice versa.

Start with the 15/43, it will give you all the OMG that you want. I love it.

Hope this was a little more coherent.

Erik
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Old 03-12-2010, 04:01 AM
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Sorry i wasn't "COHERENT", I was just trying to help.
I guess i am not as educated as some.
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Old 03-12-2010, 04:50 AM
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It does make alot more sense now, thanks to both of you for explaining to me. Although, outside of racing, I would question why someone would want to save what I would perceive to be ounces of weight.

I will start with -1 and +2 as all I really want is to achieve that holly sh** hang on feeling when I crack the throttle. As for the "actual" 520 conversion, I don't think I am going to get into widths, metals, strengths and weight.

Now, the final question....what type of sprokets are the best and should I replace the chain at the same time?
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Old 03-12-2010, 04:53 AM
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Originally Posted by hondavtr1000sp2 View Post
Sorry i wasn't "COHERENT", I was just trying to help.
I guess i am not as educated as some.
I thought you're post was quite coherent and I completely understood what you were saying. The pictures were a great touch as well

Thanks for taking the time to help out!!!
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:03 AM
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A "520 conversion" is simply a way to decrease the weight of the chain and sprocket set.

The 3 numbers that identify a motorcycle chain are related to size and are expressed in 1/8" increments.

Examples:

A) 630 chain
The roller pin centers are 6/8 (3/4") apart, and the roller width is 3.0 (3/8").

B) 520 chain
The roller pin centers are 5/8 (5/8") apart, and the roller width is 2.0 (1/4").

C) 425 chain
The roller pin centers are 4/8 (1/2") apart, and the roller width is 2.5 (5/16")


Rex
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:10 AM
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Just don't cheap out on the parts. I've got a did evr3 chain which is a very expensive and very strong chain and will last a long time. Its a 520. I'm also at -1+2 and let me tell you. It hauls serious *** now compaired to what it did before. Power comes on in any gear at any speed basically. I just roll on the throttle and she takes off pretty hard. The only drawback to it is that it now revs a good 1000 rpm or so higher while cruising down the hiway. That's the biggest draw back. But there's nothing like cruising around at city speeds in 3rd and 4th gear and just hammering it and hanging on for one hell of a fun ride
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:30 AM
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It seems a number of forum members have done the 15/43 sprocket swap.

To those who have, what is your approximate 60MPH cruise RPM (6th gear), and what type of gas mileage are you getting, relative to standard gearing?

Inquiring minds want to know!


Rex
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:34 AM
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Grizz, first up i am glad you could understand me. Thanks .

You should always replace your chain & sprockets as a set. If you just put a new chain on your old sprockets you can wear out your new chain allot quicker.

Renthal has a good Reputation.

If you get aluminium sprockets they are lighter but as a result will not last as long, but you can get a nice choice of colors if that is important to you.

There is a sprocket called SuperSprox, it is made up of a aluminium centre with a steel outer, so you get the best of both worlds - light weight & longer lasting.

Or just go for steel. Heavier, but lasts longer than aluminium.

Every one will probably have there own favorite brand.
Attached Thumbnails 520 Conversion, please explain-renthal-anodized-sprockets.jpg   520 Conversion, please explain-supersprox.jpg   520 Conversion, please explain-closeupofsupersprox.jpg  
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by hondavtr1000sp2 View Post
Sorry i wasn't "COHERENT", I was just trying to help.
I guess i am not as educated as some.
Relax, it wasn't a slight against you, PERSONALLY, so don't take it that way. Who said you weren't as educated? Poor ******* you, blah, blah, blah.

You made 3 posts, like you kept having more thoughts about it.
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by bjorn toulouse View Post
It seems a number of forum members have done the 15/43 sprocket swap.

To those who have, what is your approximate 60MPH cruise RPM (6th gear), and what type of gas mileage are you getting, relative to standard gearing?

Inquiring minds want to know!


Rex
Rex... Have a look at this spreadsheet... It'll tell you whats speeds and RPM's equals what with any sprocket you want...

https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...9&postcount=21
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Old 03-12-2010, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Erik S. View Post
Relax, it wasn't a slight against you, PERSONALLY, so don't take it that way. Who said you weren't as educated? Poor ******* you, blah, blah, blah.

You made 3 posts, like you kept having more thoughts about it.
3 posts on 3 different issues, just trying to keep them separate.

Erik,

Last edited by hondavtr1000sp2; 03-14-2010 at 06:09 PM.
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Old 03-12-2010, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by hondavtr1000sp2 View Post
3 posts on 3 different issues, just trying to keep them separate.
Today 06:04 AMhondavtr1000sp2It has nothing to do with how many teeth are on the front or rear sprockets.
Today 06:13 AMhondavtr1000sp2It is easy to change the sprockets, they just bolt on & off.
Today 06:26 AMhondavtr1000sp2Oh, but changing the amount of teeth on a sprocket is a completely different story & not called a 520 chain conversion.
Maybe you were right, you're not as smart as some people, they all look like the same issue to me.










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Old 03-12-2010, 07:31 AM
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520 conversion is awesome, much more than a few ounces. Don't think I'm talking down, just trying to address this important issue. What you need to do is learn the respective values of weight on a motorcycle to understand how valuable it is in terms of handling, accereration, stopping and bump absorption, and gyroscopic effects. The main thing to learn is that small weight reductions in areas of unsprung weight, that is any weight like wheels, tires, brake rotors sprockets, chains, etc., reap huge benefits in the areas cited above, i.e., positively and significantly affects the very nature of the motorcycle. Makes aggressive riding a totally different experience in terms of improved performance. Anywhere else on the motorcycle, you are correct in your statement about a few ounces, or even a few lbs., has little or no effect relatively.

I put a 520 vortex alum rear sprocket that lasted a couple months, piece of ****. Replaced it with the best aluminum AFAM rear and AFAM steel sprocket front. RK gold chain. I had 15/43, but when I replaced the soft Vortex, went with 15/44 tooth rear. Great for twisties, wheelies, and urban, not the best for straight road touring, stay oem for this.

Don't feel alone because many do not understand the value of reducing unsprung and spinning weight, and until you do it, you won't either. I learned it first when I replaced steel wheels with alum on my old Norton. It was riding like a different bike. But where I really learned was on my tractor trailer. When you drive 100,000 miles a year you become one with your machine. I replaced all the steel wheels with alum and the tires to low profile type and I was literally shocked at the transformation. When you make drastic reductions in spinning unsprung weight, you really realize the advantages in every thing the road conveys to you, regardless how heavy the vehicle. On a motorcycle, even small spinning weight reductions have a significant impact on everthing from smoothness to feeling your tires to quicker and more precise braking and acceleration. There is no better place to focus on. If you did nothing to your motor, carbs or suspension and lightened the wheels, rotors, tires, & sprocket(520), your bike would be immensely improved in all ways. The new Power Pure from Michelin, AFAM or supersprox 520 sprocket, lighter wheels like Mareschini, etc., pay huge dividends in all the areas mentioned above.
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Old 03-12-2010, 08:23 AM
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Dear Erik S. and hondavtr1000sp2,
Both of you helped Grizz. Both of you did a good thing. Both of you are fine people who know about VTR's.
Generally, this forum has a very positive tone.
God bless us, everyone.

Last edited by comedo; 03-12-2010 at 08:25 AM. Reason: typing blunder
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Old 03-12-2010, 08:51 AM
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AMEN!
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Old 03-12-2010, 08:55 AM
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+1. Let`s try to keep things civil and not let it degenerate into a bunch of name-calling and insulting, there are many other forums for that...

cheers
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Old 03-12-2010, 08:57 AM
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Grizz, what I have done is a 15/43 conversion, both are made by renthal and are a 530 width. since the front sprocket is smaller, and the rear is bigger I was able to keep the stock chain. Its not recommended because the old chain has worn with the old sprockets, so now the old chain is wearing with the new sprockets but not evenly. What will happen eventually because I took to cheap route is the sprockets/chain will wear out prematurely (most likely) it won't be significantly faster wearing but slightly. The cost/benefits for this mod, the way I did it worked for me. It not the 'right' way to do it but it works, and it works really well. Accel is way improved as compared to doing one or the other. I started with just doing the 43 tooth rear, improved but nothing huge. If you do the 15/43 your speedo will be way off. I would suggest getting a speedo healer to rectify that issue.
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Old 03-12-2010, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by comedo View Post
Dear Erik S. and hondavtr1000sp2,
Both of you helped Grizz. Both of you did a good thing. Both of you are fine people who know about VTR's.
Generally, this forum has a very positive tone.
God bless us, everyone.
hey. wait a minute. If we're that fragile and have to keep a positive tone so as not to offend anyone's sensitivity, and we need to hold each others hands so we can feel secure and okay with ourselves, maybe we shouldn't be riding freakin motorcycles. What is this, wimp city? WTF! Don't sugarcoat. Tell it like it is and learn from it regardless of tone. Come on now. let's start a fight club.hahahaha
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Old 03-12-2010, 09:08 AM
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Easy way to get a bit more grunt is simply replace the rear sprocket with a +2 530 one.

You don't need to get at the front sprocket or buy a new chain. You don't even have to remove the chain. Just pull the wheel, swap sprockets and put the wheel back on.

16/43 makes a difference you can feel. Changing chain and sprockets all at the same time is good general advice, but unless they're high mileage, I wouldn't (didn't) hassle it.
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Old 03-12-2010, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by nath981 View Post
hey. wait a minute. If we're that fragile and have to keep a positive tone so as not to offend anyone's sensitivity, and we need to hold each others hands so we can feel secure and okay with ourselves, maybe we shouldn't be riding freakin motorcycles. What is this, wimp city? WTF! Don't sugarcoat. Tell it like it is and learn from it regardless of tone. Come on now. let's start a fight club.hahahaha
Nath, there may already be a fight club, but, since the first rule of fight club is don't talk about fight club, we'll never know if there is one. LOL
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Old 03-12-2010, 09:15 AM
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The information I read from both guys was all the same. I guess if you don't word it correctly or all in one post, you're an idiot? Can't we all just get along?

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Old 03-12-2010, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Grizz View Post
Ok, not sure if this question will make me a retard or not but here goes.....

I am looking at doing a sproket change as I want more "OMG hang on" boost from the hawk. I am planning to drop one tooth from the front and go up 2 on the rear. I thought this was what's known as the 520 conversion but have read some posts recently that indicate there may be more to it. Can someone please explain what else is involved??

Also, how hard is it to do yourself as apposed to having it done professionally??

I tried to do a search but it was not working very well and I could not find anythng in the Knowlege Base.
As far as doin yourself, it's not too bad if you take your time, however, you will need a tool to cut chain and install the master link (rivit type)unless you go with a clip type, not recommended. I got a motion pro($90), expensive but woth it when you caluclate the risk. Installing the rivit link takes care unless you want to risk the chain breakin at speed. And you have to guessitmate the length to cut off new chain since they are typically longer than required.
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Old 03-12-2010, 09:21 AM
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The world has proven that we cant all just get along... But if the two of them atleast have the humour to add those smileys and all I don't think it's a big problem...

If it is a problem, I say let them deal with it themselves...
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Old 03-12-2010, 10:27 AM
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Hopefully I am not stealing the post a bit but I have a similiar question as GRIZZ, but Oppsotie, (or the exact same but different). I am looking to join in on a road trip from Illinois to Colorado on my SH and am not so much looking for OMG hold on as I am how fast can I go without burning up my whole tank in 75 miles. I am going to have to keep up (mpg wise) with i4's and I know my tanks is small but can I do the opposite with my sprockets (since what I am reading this seems to be an easy swap back and forth) so that I get much better highway riding?
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Old 03-12-2010, 11:02 AM
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Probably not... The VTR isn't going to use much less gas on a long stretch of highway at speed with taller gearing... It's just not going to be able to rev out instead... As is now with stock gearing and a stock engine you actually have top speed in fifth as it can't reach full range in sixth...

Plus, taller gears mean to get you "better highway riding" would mean what lower revs? That's not going to improve mileage...

To get best possible mileage on a long run... Inflate the tires a bit over recommended, clean, lube and general overhaul of the driveline, clean your airfilter (or replace, as you please)...

Mechanicaly, a good carb setup will get you fuel efficiency... But that should have been done and tested looong before the roadtrip...

As for getting the most out of each tank, find the sweetspot in the RPM range... In theory an engine is most efficient at peak torque... (If we ignore all the possible losses and a lot of other stuff we can't really know or calculate as well...) On a stock engine peak torque is somewhere between 7000 and 7500 RPM... Keep the engine here, make very slow, slowmotion movements on the throttle and switch gears smoothly and you should increase mileage noticably...

Makes for pretty booring riding though...
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Old 03-12-2010, 11:05 AM
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you may want to consider a extra gas container for emergency or at least syphon apparatus to suck off your friends in case. I don't think raising your gearing will help runnin 75mph, but I don't know fer sher cause I ain't don it.
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Old 03-12-2010, 11:11 AM
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Yeah... Fuel bottle in the pack or under the saddle is almost a neccesity if you aren't going on a road that has frequent filling opportunities... The VTR isn't the most frugal bike made... It's not a matter of IF... It's a matter of WHEN you are going to run out of fuel smack dab in the middle between to stations...
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