Technical Discussion Topics related to Technical Issues

Wheel balancing... how critical?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 05:18 PM
  #1  
CentralCoaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
SuperSport
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 987
From: San Diego, CA
CentralCoaster is on a distinguished road
Wheel balancing... how critical?

This might be a completely stupid question... but how critical is tire balancing on a bike? Front? Rear?

I had one shop tell me awhile back that there was no need to balance the front wheel after a tire install, they said to just stick it on there like you're changing a bicycle tire. This raised my eyebrows.



And the shop I've gone to doesn't seem to be balancing the wheels after a tire install. I'm 95% sure that they didn't even touch the wheel weights. This is annoying because I finally established a repoire with these guys, which is rare, because I normally fix my own ****. Plus this shop and is 1 mile from my work. My buddy takes his bike 25 miles away to Santee which is very inconvenient, but if that's what it takes to get what you pay for...

Should I make a stink about this? The other shop worker claims they do, but he didn't do the tire on my bike.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 05:26 PM
  #2  
cliby's Avatar
Senior Member
SuperBike
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,548
From: MN
cliby is on a distinguished road
yes. IMO they don't sound qualified. Tires differ. To not balance is crazy if you paid to have this done. The front is very noticeable when out of balance - the rear much less so because there are other factors (sprocket/chain) that impact it, but I can't imagine the rationale for skipping it. Except a lazy shop.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 05:42 PM
  #3  
nath981's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,934
From: altoona, pa
nath981 is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
This might be a completely stupid question... but how critical is tire balancing on a bike? Front? Rear?

I had one shop tell me awhile back that there was no need to balance the front wheel after a tire install, they said to just stick it on there like you're changing a bicycle tire. This raised my eyebrows.
And the shop I've gone to doesn't seem to be balancing the wheels after a tire install. I'm 95% sure that they didn't even touch the wheel weights. This is annoying because I finally established a repoire with these guys, which is rare, because I normally fix my own ****. Plus this shop and is 1 mile from my work. My buddy takes his bike 25 miles away to Santee which is very inconvenient, but if that's what it takes to get what you pay for...

Should I make a stink about this? The other shop worker claims they do, but he didn't do the tire on my bike.
anyone that tells you to just stick it on like a bicycle tire is a person that you should never let get near anything you or anyone you care about owns. Hell, I'm not even that nonchalant about my bicycle tires.

as far as touching your wheel weights, it's possible that they could be in balance. I would at least check to see that the little painted circle is aligned with the valve stem, that the tire's bead line is even all the way around the wheel, and that the tire is inflated correctly.

you can check the balance if you have a couple jackstands and/or you can also get balance beads and put them into your tires via the valve stems.

Make a stink if you don't really know for certain, NO.
Go back there again, Never.

thanks, nathan

Last edited by nath981; Mar 4, 2009 at 06:18 PM.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 05:44 PM
  #4  
steve.g's Avatar
Senior Member
Superstock
 
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 347
From: S.Dak USA
steve.g is on a distinguished road
I think balancing is very important,especially the front. A good shop should quote you a price for tires with mount and balance INCLUDED...
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 06:27 PM
  #5  
CentralCoaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
SuperSport
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 987
From: San Diego, CA
CentralCoaster is on a distinguished road
I checked some old photos of my bike and yes, the weights are in the exact same place as when I first bought it. That was two rear tires and one front tire ago. (All 3 by this shop.)

They wiped the wheel clean, but it's obvious where they wiped around the weights. Hard to tell how old the tape is. Even if they touched the weights, they just stuck them back on the same spot.


Grrr...
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 06:41 PM
  #6  
k-d-williams's Avatar
Senior Member
SuperBike
 
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,188
From: New Braunfels, Texas
k-d-williams is on a distinguished road
The first set of new tires I bought for my bike were not balanced. About 115 mph the bike had a slight shake and the shake got worse the faster i went. Took the bike back and had them balanced and then it rode like glass.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 06:53 PM
  #7  
zmaniv's Avatar
Senior Member
SuperSport
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 916
From: San Diego
zmaniv is on a distinguished road
Take it in to Mike at Full throttle and quit your whining
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 08:24 PM
  #8  
CentralCoaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
SuperSport
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 987
From: San Diego, CA
CentralCoaster is on a distinguished road
Invoice shows "mount and balance"

I think I'm going to ride in there tomorrow morning and give them an ultimatum. They're going to remove and balance both tires for free, or else they never see my credit card again.

Although if I have to nag them to not half-*** my bike, then I probably won't go back regardless.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 08:56 PM
  #9  
Hotbrakes's Avatar
Senior Member
SuperSport
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 714
From: Fredericksburg, VA
Hotbrakes is on a distinguished road
Seems the last few times I've balanced mine, the wheels have been perfect with the weights in the same place. Maybe that's what they assume? But I always stick them on the balancer to make sure. 3/4" all thread on a couple sticks of wood works great.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 09:46 PM
  #10  
inderocker's Avatar
Moderator
MotoGP
 
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,708
inderocker is an unknown quantity at this point
More often than not, it is the wheel itself that is out of balance, not the tire. This might explain why the weights on your rim have not moved.

I've computer balanced my rims by themselves and found the rear needed .5 grams without a tire on it but then zeroed out with a new tire on it. I assume that the added overall mass has something to do with it.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 09:49 PM
  #11  
VTRsurfer's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 3,452
From: San Clemente, CA
VTRsurfer is on a distinguished road
How much vibration do you want at 80 mph?
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 09:55 PM
  #12  
VTRsurfer's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 3,452
From: San Clemente, CA
VTRsurfer is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by inderocker
More often than not, it is the wheel itself that is out of balance, not the tire. This might explain why the weights on your rim have not moved.

I've computer balanced my rims by themselves and found the rear needed .5 grams without a tire on it but then zeroed out with a new tire on it. I assume that the added overall mass has something to do with it.
In the last 28 years and 175,000 miles I've had several front tires that did not require any weights. Motorcycle tires are much smaller than car tires, and cost much more, so every so often you'll get one that is spot on.

In 34 years of balancing car tires, I've only run across a couple that did not require any weights.
Old Mar 4, 2009 | 10:42 PM
  #13  
Hawkrider's Avatar
Administrator
World Champion
 
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 105,287
From: Fulton, MO
Hawkrider will become famous soon enoughHawkrider will become famous soon enough
I'm like Inderocker, I balance the wheel and mark the heavy spot once, then align the mark to the heavy spot whenever a new tire is installed. Many tires don't even have marks on them anymore. I know Michelin Pilot Powers don't, and I don't think Pirelli Diablo Corsa IIIs do either. I've changed a lot of tires, as you can imagine with NoMar being a family business. I've seen some tires and wheels that are pretty bad WRT balance, and yes it does make a difference.
Old Mar 5, 2009 | 08:33 PM
  #14  
Slim's Avatar
Senior Member
Back Marker
 
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 203
From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Slim is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
Invoice shows "mount and balance"

I think I'm going to ride in there tomorrow morning and give them an ultimatum. They're going to remove and balance both tires for free, or else they never see my credit card again.

Although if I have to nag them to not half-*** my bike, then I probably won't go back regardless.
But the real kick in the *** is that you never noticed until now, after seeing it, and not feeling it, right?



Since i'm the type of nut case that likes to speed excessively on the ride to work I have mine balanced. For racers it makes the difference of a few tenths, for me it makes the difference of swiping my card 'not late'.
Old Mar 5, 2009 | 08:42 PM
  #15  
cliby's Avatar
Senior Member
SuperBike
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,548
From: MN
cliby is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by Hawkrider
............I've changed a lot of tires, as you can imagine with NoMar being a family business. ..........
nomar being a family business! as in your family? quite a nice product. A couple of my riding buddies are getting ready to go in on one we can all use.
Old Mar 5, 2009 | 09:55 PM
  #16  
Hawkrider's Avatar
Administrator
World Champion
 
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 105,287
From: Fulton, MO
Hawkrider will become famous soon enoughHawkrider will become famous soon enough
Yup, my brother Steve started and owns the company.
Old Mar 6, 2009 | 03:46 AM
  #17  
FTMS's Avatar
Senior Member
Superstock
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 284
From: Warren, NH
FTMS is on a distinguished road
I have changed a lot of tires in my shop and most of the time I don't have to move the weights. You really are balancing the rim. The quality of good tires come from the factory balanced. When you get into the cheap tires you might have more problems with tire balancing.
Old Mar 6, 2009 | 04:36 AM
  #18  
Erik S.'s Avatar
Senior Member
SuperBike
 
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,216
From: Westerly, RI
Erik S. is on a distinguished road
NoMar, nice product. Saw the booth at the Javitt Center this year. Riding buddy is/was planning on getting one this week in Daytona.
Old Mar 6, 2009 | 05:31 AM
  #19  
cliby's Avatar
Senior Member
SuperBike
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,548
From: MN
cliby is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by Hawkrider
Yup, my brother Steve started and owns the company.
very cool. I have been looking at different changers for a year now. this is hands down the best thing out there and from all accounts the customer service/support is outstanding.

For anyone who isn't familiar with this, you should check it out - not cheap, but in a very short time a couple of riders having a couple bikes could easily pay for itself when you figure cost of mount/balance, running your wheels into the shop, and the ability to buy tires much cheaper online - especially if you ride a lot or do occasional track days. I believe its just nomartirechanger.com they have a lot of material and demonstration videos.
Old Mar 6, 2009 | 08:17 AM
  #20  
Dano's Avatar
Member
Squid
 
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 53
From: Fort Collins, CO
Dano is on a distinguished road
The shop told you there was no need to balance tires? I'd never take anything to that shop ever again if they dont agree to check the balance free of charge and show you in person how they know it is balanced correctly.

I'm a complete ******* about this sort of stuff because I had a nasty run in with a "reputable shop" on another bike of mine. Had them doing a bearing swap on a set of rims and install a set of tires with balancing. The one time I didn't triple check the mechanics work and it could have cost me my life. One of the bearings required a metal reducer from the factory to be pressed out of the old bearing, into the new one, then the new assembly installed. Well, when the guy popped out the old bearing, he just chucked it in the trash, installed the new one, put the dust cover on. I picked everything up and didn't check it over because everyone said it was the best shop in town, figured they knew what the hell they were doing right? This caused the axle to ride on the DUST COVER, not the bearing as it should have. The bike rode like ****, wobbled, rumbled, shook like hell. Upon pulling both wheels off and looking at them again, we saw what the guy did. If I had been on the highway hauling *** and had that tire lockup cockeyed I would have been pitched to the pavement or at the very least skidded to a halt shitting myself. It also proved he didn't balance the tire because he would have seen immediately that it was all over the place on the balancer because the reducer wasn't in place. I caused a huge shitstorm with the service manager after he tried to tell me that it wasnt a big deal, I had to pay for the work to fix it and that his wrench monkey wasn't at fault. After emptying their showroom of potential customers over my fit, I left and had a different guy fix everything while I watched. We found that nothing was balanced, the guy had jacked up the wheels so bad trying to true the front rim I had to toss it and a trove other lazy bullshit the guy charged me for and never did.

Long story short, small stuff can kill you, triple check everything, if its not 110% correct, take that **** back and demand it be done right in front of you because this how people are killed at the hands of others laziness or negligence.
Old Mar 6, 2009 | 02:59 PM
  #21  
HondaJim's Avatar
Will drum for BBQ
Back Marker
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 166
From: Kentucky
HondaJim is on a distinguished road
It's pretty easy to double check balance on a front wheel. Remove the calipers and spin it. Mark the bottom of the tire where it stops. Do this a number of times. The more you do it the more accurate the check. If it always stops at the same place that part is probably heavy. If it's random, it's probably in balance. Like I said, easy double check. This is all based on having good wheel bearings.

If it spins to a stop and then spins backwards, it's definitely heavy in one spot.

I do all of my own work except change tires. I take the wheels off and take them to a guy who I watch balance them. In the twenty something years I've been doing this I had one wheel I had to have rebalanced, verified by the method above. I think my wheel guy was hung over that morning.
Old Mar 6, 2009 | 08:46 PM
  #22  
VTRsurfer's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 3,452
From: San Clemente, CA
VTRsurfer is on a distinguished road
I just remembered that on the first bike I bought in 1981, a CX500 modded for canyon racing, I never balanced the wheels. I put 53,000 miles on it and only ran Michelins which I changed over a plastic trash can. It topped out at 105 mph and I never noticed any vibration.

Of course tires and wheels in those days were much narrower.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
mikstr
Technical Discussion
4
Jul 7, 2015 05:36 AM
jscobey
Technical Discussion
5
May 20, 2014 05:20 AM
20_rc51_00
General Discussion
1
Aug 7, 2011 05:18 AM
mikstr
Modifications - Performance
26
Jun 10, 2009 06:01 AM
Loco
Classifieds
2
Apr 12, 2006 07:24 AM




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:51 AM.


Top

© 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands



When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.