Swing arm damaged - advice please?
12-13-2009, 04:57 PM
#1
Senior Member
Back Marker
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 201
Swing arm damaged - advice please?
When I bought my 'new' VTR last month, I noticed that the swing arm is damaged. It's a low mileage bike (8,000 miles) and I can't imagine how the swing arm has become damaged like this. Questions;
Any ideas how I can cosmetically repair it?
and, if not,
How big is the task of replacing the swing arm?
Pics attached...any advice please?
Any ideas how I can cosmetically repair it?
and, if not,
How big is the task of replacing the swing arm?
Pics attached...any advice please?
12-13-2009, 05:05 PM
#2
Senior Member
SuperSport
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: In a van down by the river (I wish!)
Posts: 617
What PERFECT timing! Go ahead and order a JCM swingarm!
http://www.swingarm.com/
It will take about three months to get something back, but the bling just can't be beat. Just tell the SO that it's a safety issue. That's what I'm going to do with the RC51 caliper upgrade and CF tank.
R.
http://www.swingarm.com/
It will take about three months to get something back, but the bling just can't be beat. Just tell the SO that it's a safety issue. That's what I'm going to do with the RC51 caliper upgrade and CF tank.
R.
12-13-2009, 05:35 PM
#5
Senior Member
SuperSport
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: In a van down by the river (I wish!)
Posts: 617
I think Tweety has a good write up of a RC51 swingarm swap somewhere that I saw while digging through the search. I'll see if I have it in my bookmarks somewhere. The pictures are here:
http://images.tweety.se/#1.1
I've swapped out swingarms on bikes that are now vintage bikes, but nothing in the last 10 years. You have bearings you have to deal with, but other than that it was pretty simple...
Always upgrade when you replace!
-R.
http://images.tweety.se/#1.1
I've swapped out swingarms on bikes that are now vintage bikes, but nothing in the last 10 years. You have bearings you have to deal with, but other than that it was pretty simple...
Always upgrade when you replace!
-R.
12-13-2009, 05:38 PM
#7
Junior Member
Squid
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Denton TX
Posts: 17
I've got the same wear on mine from the Two Brother's exhaust rubbing. Perhaps stock might rub a little as well?.. I don't know, never seen stock exhaust. Bummer since you have the high mounts, and can't cover it up.
12-13-2009, 05:40 PM
#9
Senior Member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2008
Location: S.Dak USA
Posts: 347
From the looks of the pics it doesn't appear to be to bad.Think I would remove the rear wheel,pull the chain out of the way and clean up the damage with a fine file,finish with emery cloth and call it good. A good welder could build up the damaged area with a couple of beads and then file/finish. Removing the swingarm is not difficult.The bike needs to be suspended securely. I remove the seat,rear bodywork and suspend with a couple of good straps around the rear subframe tied to a steel saw horse I have. Some guys tie the straps to the rafters in the garage.The point is to get the rear wheel off the ground so you can remove it. If you look closely the swingarm only has one long pivot bolt securing it to the engine.You have to disconnect/remove a few things before you take out the bolt,but if you look closely it is not difficult. There is a shop manual that can be downloaded from this site,just do a search.Good Luck!
Last edited by steve.g; 12-13-2009 at 06:01 PM.
12-13-2009, 05:46 PM
#10
Moderator
MotoGP
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,708
Looks like damage from some low mount/stock exhaust that was bent inward from a drop (obviously pre-high-mount). Look for a clean one to pop up on eBay. I never really have too much luck selling swingarms, so they usually end up going to the scrap yard. If i come across a nice one i will let you know.
Last edited by inderocker; 12-13-2009 at 08:58 PM.
12-13-2009, 05:46 PM
#11
Senior Member
Back Marker
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 201
Hey Steve, noticed that you are a Man U fan! I'm a Brit form Northern England - 30 miles west of Manchester (now emigrated to Toronto)....just had to Tell you, Giggsy won Sportsman of the Year award tonight at the BBC awards in London! Good lad!
And thanks for the advice - very much appreciated!
And thanks for the advice - very much appreciated!
12-13-2009, 05:48 PM
#12
Senior Member
SuperSport
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: In a van down by the river (I wish!)
Posts: 617
God no! Upgrade! Repeat: "Hon, this is a safety issue. It could, you know, snap at any minute!" Never concede that a mod is superficial or performance oriented. My wife is a smart gal, but I've sold her on all sorts of silly baubles. Be creative!
I know Bill (cliby) has a JMC swingarm. It should be a bolt-on swap and you can even choose what size rim you want to run. I got one for an RZ350 years ago that they totally botched (matching it to a LC350), but good lord what a piece of art! For years I carried it around as a conversation piece. You will not find better welds anywhere in the civilized world.
You know you want it.
BTW: The manual is here -- http://www.superhawk996.net/Honda_VT...ice_Manual.pdf
Randy
I know Bill (cliby) has a JMC swingarm. It should be a bolt-on swap and you can even choose what size rim you want to run. I got one for an RZ350 years ago that they totally botched (matching it to a LC350), but good lord what a piece of art! For years I carried it around as a conversation piece. You will not find better welds anywhere in the civilized world.
You know you want it.
BTW: The manual is here -- http://www.superhawk996.net/Honda_VT...ice_Manual.pdf
Randy
Last edited by Crashrat; 12-13-2009 at 07:06 PM.
12-13-2009, 05:51 PM
#13
Senior Member
Back Marker
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 201
Thanks Inderocker - funnily enough, although the bike has low miles - lot's of signs that it was unloved...and it has a Hindle aftermarket high mount exhaust....(so what happened to the stock piece I have no idea).
Throwing a chain could also be the cause?
Bike also has a bent side stand ...what the heck? !! I picked up a new Honda part for that - but how the heck could that happen?
At least the bike has a good home now...
Throwing a chain could also be the cause?
Bike also has a bent side stand ...what the heck? !! I picked up a new Honda part for that - but how the heck could that happen?
At least the bike has a good home now...
12-13-2009, 05:53 PM
#14
Senior Member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2008
Location: S.Dak USA
Posts: 347
Hey Steve, noticed that you are a Man U fan! I'm a Brit form Northern England - 30 miles west of Manchester (now emigrated to Toronto)....just had to Tell you, Giggsy won Sportsman of the Year award tonight at the BBC awards in London! Good lad!
And thanks for the advice - very much appreciated!
And thanks for the advice - very much appreciated!
You a scouser? Liverpool got beat today at home v the gooners. I grew up in Bedfordshire,been a Utd. fan since Bobby Charlton scored 2 against Portugal in the '66 World Cup semi-final.Used to go to OT every home game up until 85 when I moved here.Post up some pics of your bike and welcome...!!
Last edited by steve.g; 12-13-2009 at 05:55 PM.
12-13-2009, 07:09 PM
#16
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: MN
Posts: 1,548
I have my old superhawk swingarm if you need one. cheap! its like new I'm sure (at least structurally, never crashed, low miles)
the JMC experience was terrible. the part is nice, but god what a wrotten organization and the worst customer service. If you have a year, you can probably get them to make you one. It is beautiful as crashrat says, but I can't recommend them for trying to get one.
the JMC experience was terrible. the part is nice, but god what a wrotten organization and the worst customer service. If you have a year, you can probably get them to make you one. It is beautiful as crashrat says, but I can't recommend them for trying to get one.
12-13-2009, 07:53 PM
#18
OCMD honorary member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 252
I think the chain.....
CSI work is always fun. Initially when I first looked at the pics I thought someone ran a strap through the swingarm and wheel when transporting, the metal rachet rubbing up against the swingarm. But how does that explain the many small scratches on the side that curl up to the main damage.
Trackdayhawk said chain and it clicked for me.
Think of the chain coming off the rear sprocket with no chain guard on the bike. The chain is pulled from the top side of the front sprocket, it would want to keep feeding and it wouldn't take long to do that damage even if you pulled in the clutch really fast.
Get another swingarm.
-Stock, of course would be the easy.
-Single sided, or RC51 directions are both listed on this site. Some machining...
-You could repair it, Fill it with weld but the grain would never look quite right, you would need to powdercoat it or live with it.
Of course I could be wrong and I release any and all liability with my statements.
CSI work is always fun. Initially when I first looked at the pics I thought someone ran a strap through the swingarm and wheel when transporting, the metal rachet rubbing up against the swingarm. But how does that explain the many small scratches on the side that curl up to the main damage.
Trackdayhawk said chain and it clicked for me.
Think of the chain coming off the rear sprocket with no chain guard on the bike. The chain is pulled from the top side of the front sprocket, it would want to keep feeding and it wouldn't take long to do that damage even if you pulled in the clutch really fast.
Get another swingarm.
-Stock, of course would be the easy.
-Single sided, or RC51 directions are both listed on this site. Some machining...
-You could repair it, Fill it with weld but the grain would never look quite right, you would need to powdercoat it or live with it.
Of course I could be wrong and I release any and all liability with my statements.
12-13-2009, 08:38 PM
#21
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,116
It can easily be repaired DIY if your are at all handy. DO NOT have it TIG welded! But without doing anything but removing the rear bolt (and loosing the front bolt) and lifting the chain guard out of the way (or temporarily removing it, and if your concerned, maybe also removing the rear wheel), the aluminum can be built-up using 3rd generation of "Lumiweld" rod and a propane or better, MAP gas torch. This process is relatively low temp, very strong and can be shaped back to nearly match new. Go to below link to find out about product which can be bought at many hardware stores, welding supply houses and from the manufacturer.
http://aluminumrepair.com/land/index...FQUMDQod_G0XtA
http://aluminumrepair.com/land/index...FQUMDQod_G0XtA
12-13-2009, 09:05 PM
#22
OCMD honorary member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 252
It can easily be repaired DIY if your are at all handy. DO NOT have it TIG welded! But without doing anything but removing the rear bolt (and loosing the front bolt) and lifting the chain guard out of the way (or temporarily removing it, and if your concerned, maybe also removing the rear wheel), the aluminum can be built-up using 3rd generation of "Lumiweld" rod and a propane or better, MAP gas torch. This process is relatively low temp, very strong and can be shaped back to nearly match new. Go to below link to find out about product which can be bought at many hardware stores, welding supply houses and from the manufacturer.
http://aluminumrepair.com/land/index...FQUMDQod_G0XtA
http://aluminumrepair.com/land/index...FQUMDQod_G0XtA
I'm guessing that you would have to finish the whole swingarm in whatever fashion or live with an area that is more polished?
12-13-2009, 09:43 PM
#24
OCMD honorary member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 252
I've used scotch brite with pretty good results, I guess how much of a **** bastard do you want to be about it.
Like you said they work well.
I guess with practice and technique it could even work weller.
Of course I could be wrong and I release any and all liability concerning my statements.
Like you said they work well.
I guess with practice and technique it could even work weller.
Of course I could be wrong and I release any and all liability concerning my statements.
12-13-2009, 11:51 PM
#25
Banned
MotoGP
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Lake View Terrace, CA
Posts: 5,942
1ea) BEARING, NEEDLE 91071-MR7-003 $16.60
2ea) BEARING 91072-MR7-003 $11.66
2ea) DUST SEAL 91202-MR7-003 $4.26
1ea) DUST SEAL 91257-KY4-900 $3.27
1ea) DUST SEAL 91261-KZ3-861 $5.21
just happen to have the info from Ron Ayers as I'm getting ready for a bearing change on mine.
12-14-2009, 05:06 AM
#26
Senior Member
SuperSport
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: In a van down by the river (I wish!)
Posts: 617
Depends on what you want, I guess. Like I say, I always upgrade when something goes. It's often just as cheap if you can source better used parts online. The JMC saves like 40% on weight (they claim) and I'm certain other swingarms are as stiff as ours, weigh less, and have more bling.
This is a superficial issue any way you chalk it, so if you are shallow enough to have it rub you the wrong way -- and it probably would rub me the wrong way -- you should probably just replace it. Unless you do this sort of work for a living, it is never going to look right, especially to your eyes.
The costs for parts 8541Hawk lists above shouldn't break your bank if you decide to just look for a stock replacement. There's a VTR swingarm on Ebay right now for $30:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1999-...Q5fAccessories
As I say, it really is a perspective thing. You will find folks here who have done transplants for no reason whatsoever. Maybe they were racers, maybe they wanted to turn a wrench on their down time, or maybe they just wanted to do something unusual. If it were me, and I had the time, skill and $$$, I'd certainly try to upgrade this item...
This is a superficial issue any way you chalk it, so if you are shallow enough to have it rub you the wrong way -- and it probably would rub me the wrong way -- you should probably just replace it. Unless you do this sort of work for a living, it is never going to look right, especially to your eyes.
The costs for parts 8541Hawk lists above shouldn't break your bank if you decide to just look for a stock replacement. There's a VTR swingarm on Ebay right now for $30:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1999-...Q5fAccessories
As I say, it really is a perspective thing. You will find folks here who have done transplants for no reason whatsoever. Maybe they were racers, maybe they wanted to turn a wrench on their down time, or maybe they just wanted to do something unusual. If it were me, and I had the time, skill and $$$, I'd certainly try to upgrade this item...
Last edited by Crashrat; 12-14-2009 at 05:10 AM.
12-14-2009, 06:20 PM
#27
Senior Member
Back Marker
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 201
Guys, this is great info...thanks so much! Ya know - they second owner apparently was a very heavy guy - like 300 lbs plus...and when I look at a standard exhaust set up in pics I can concur with Inderocker - the exhaust rubbing the swing arm just could be one cause...
I found a virtually new stock system on Kijiji for $100...which at that price is worth having anyways - so I'll pick it up for the heck of it...and in the meantime my winter project is to repair the existing swing arm. If I screw it up I'll let you know!
Thanks again for all your wisdom and advice.
John
I found a virtually new stock system on Kijiji for $100...which at that price is worth having anyways - so I'll pick it up for the heck of it...and in the meantime my winter project is to repair the existing swing arm. If I screw it up I'll let you know!
Thanks again for all your wisdom and advice.
John
12-15-2009, 09:20 AM
#28
Senior Member
SuperSport
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: In a van down by the river (I wish!)
Posts: 617
I'm a little confused. So are you dealing with the swingarm at all or just changing the exhaust? I'm just wondering.
BTW: The ultimate cheese move would be to just cover the whole swingarm with this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/3D-BL...Q5fAccessories
BTW: The ultimate cheese move would be to just cover the whole swingarm with this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/3D-BL...Q5fAccessories
12-15-2009, 02:24 PM
#30
OCMD honorary member
Superstock
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 252
I've seen exhaust damage swingarms as well. Not out of the question.
How do you explain the small hairline scratches on the side that curl.
In my mind it looks like the side of a chain coming across swingarm side and decal, then cuts across swingarm edge towards front sprocket. How would an exhaust damage the swingarm all the way down to the bottom of the swingarm? The main gouges look like someone tried to Dr. them up with a file or something.
I guess it really does not matter now. You have different pipes,you don't weigh 300lbs (I'm guessing), you have a chain guard in place, and you'll keep up with the adjustment.
Fix it and ride.
How do you explain the small hairline scratches on the side that curl.
In my mind it looks like the side of a chain coming across swingarm side and decal, then cuts across swingarm edge towards front sprocket. How would an exhaust damage the swingarm all the way down to the bottom of the swingarm? The main gouges look like someone tried to Dr. them up with a file or something.
I guess it really does not matter now. You have different pipes,you don't weigh 300lbs (I'm guessing), you have a chain guard in place, and you'll keep up with the adjustment.
Fix it and ride.
