(Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
01-14-2006, 08:38 PM
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
Moving right along here 
Back from the shop, where they mounted up some rubber on the wheels. I pulled a 190 out of the old 'Busa pile for the rear, and bought a Mich Pilot Sport Power (?) for the front. Some niiiiiiice soft, dual compound rubber to compliment that rock hard old Dunlop on the rear 
Good news is the stock calipers WILL work, you just have to dremel a little off the mounting nub for the fender. Doing that now. My fender arrived, beat up rather bad in shipping, but some sanding and a quick blast of black paint should make it presentable until a red one shows on ebay.
Here she stands so far:
Going together smoothly!
Watching for TL1000 Heli's on ebay, will use 50 mm clipons up high until then.
I'm VERY tempted to paint the rotor carriers flat black. Got the high temp paint in the garage... For reasons only the italians may know, instead of using the stock rotor bolts (6mm) they went up a size to either 6.5mm or 7mm as the stockers are way to loose! Still tracking down the exact size.
My new work station Looooooving having my own garage now! Heater is cranked, tunes are on, and even have a microwave for those quick coffee reheats 
Back from the shop, where they mounted up some rubber on the wheels. I pulled a 190 out of the old 'Busa pile for the rear, and bought a Mich Pilot Sport Power (?) for the front. Some niiiiiiice soft, dual compound rubber to compliment that rock hard old Dunlop on the rear Good news is the stock calipers WILL work, you just have to dremel a little off the mounting nub for the fender. Doing that now. My fender arrived, beat up rather bad in shipping, but some sanding and a quick blast of black paint should make it presentable until a red one shows on ebay.
Here she stands so far:
Going together smoothly!
Watching for TL1000 Heli's on ebay, will use 50 mm clipons up high until then.
I'm VERY tempted to paint the rotor carriers flat black. Got the high temp paint in the garage... For reasons only the italians may know, instead of using the stock rotor bolts (6mm) they went up a size to either 6.5mm or 7mm as the stockers are way to loose! Still tracking down the exact size.
My new work station
Looooooving having my own garage now! Heater is cranked, tunes are on, and even have a microwave for those quick coffee reheats
01-14-2006, 09:56 PM
#34
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
Look forward to getting back out again. Its rained 25 days in a row out here! We're about to set a new record. At least the Seahawks won
Dremelling done, so mounted it up. Brakes drag a bit, but I'm guessing if I force the pistons back then pump it back up, they'll center up. These rotors are quite a bit larger then the stock VTRs in diameter, and look a smidge thicker.
Down side to the stock calipers, is the rear mounting points on the fender will foul on the caliper. As my rear tabs didn't survive shipping, no big deal and I'll just realign the hole after the repair completely drys.
Dremelling done, so mounted it up. Brakes drag a bit, but I'm guessing if I force the pistons back then pump it back up, they'll center up. These rotors are quite a bit larger then the stock VTRs in diameter, and look a smidge thicker.
Down side to the stock calipers, is the rear mounting points on the fender will foul on the caliper. As my rear tabs didn't survive shipping, no big deal and I'll just realign the hole after the repair completely drys.
01-16-2006, 11:19 PM
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
Interesting update. I was going mad trying to get the rotors on the front wheels. The stock 6mm bolts were too small (rattled around when fully screwed in) but a 7mm was to big! After many hardware store visits, I discovered a 1/4" x 28 bolt was snug, but the threads bound after a few turns.
Where on earth do you find an SAE diameter bolt with metric threads?
Ya don't!
Turns out the VTR1000-SP1 uses 6.3mm x 1 bolts instead of 6's. Why on EARTH they changed to that size I'll never know when the 929, VTR AND RC-51 use 6mm (why does it even exist?! 6.3mm = 1/4 "!!!), but now the hunt is on for a dozen of 'em!
My girlfriend must have thought I was nuts taking that wheel everywhere I went all weekend (and even to the office today!) looking for those bolts!
Where on earth do you find an SAE diameter bolt with metric threads?
Ya don't!
Turns out the VTR1000-SP1 uses 6.3mm x 1 bolts instead of 6's. Why on EARTH they changed to that size I'll never know when the 929, VTR AND RC-51 use 6mm (why does it even exist?! 6.3mm = 1/4 "!!!), but now the hunt is on for a dozen of 'em!
My girlfriend must have thought I was nuts taking that wheel everywhere I went all weekend (and even to the office today!) looking for those bolts!
01-17-2006, 07:34 AM
#36
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That's F'd up mang. It must be your rims because the RC rim on the front of mine used the mounting bolts from my SH wheel. Oh well that's the price you pay for those pretty rims. All this work for a set of rims 
oh well it'll be worth it.
oh well it'll be worth it.
01-17-2006, 10:14 PM
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
Sloooooowly getting there on the front! Do hope the rear goes smoother
After looking at the gold rotors on the black wheels, I decided black was the way to go. Scrubbed 'em, scuffed 'em, then high temp flat blacked 'em.
If Tacoma Screw can find the magical "Euro-bolts" tomorrow, then I can get the whole front back together in about an hour or so!
After looking at the gold rotors on the black wheels, I decided black was the way to go. Scrubbed 'em, scuffed 'em, then high temp flat blacked 'em.
If Tacoma Screw can find the magical "Euro-bolts" tomorrow, then I can get the whole front back together in about an hour or so!
02-13-2006, 11:22 AM
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
Back in action
Friend of mine retapped the wheel for the 7mm titanium, weird headed bolts that OZ sent and enlarged the rotor holes, so I now have rotors on a wheel!
Tracking down a set of clip ons that'll have the necessary clearance, and patching up some damage to the 929 fender (ebayer closed account after 4 neg feedback from crappy packing on bodywork) which shouldn't take too long.
Close!
Friend of mine retapped the wheel for the 7mm titanium, weird headed bolts that OZ sent and enlarged the rotor holes, so I now have rotors on a wheel!
Tracking down a set of clip ons that'll have the necessary clearance, and patching up some damage to the 929 fender (ebayer closed account after 4 neg feedback from crappy packing on bodywork) which shouldn't take too long.
Close!
02-13-2006, 11:31 AM
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
If I would've known how long the bike was going to be down, I'd have started the rear too. Wasn't expecting it to take more then a weekend Weather was too nice, so had to get it back on the street for a bit!
Weather was too nice, so had to get it back on the street for a bit!
05-08-2006, 07:54 AM
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Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
Well FINALLY getting back to this! Don't blame me, blame the girlfriend! Bought me an RC airplane and I got sidetracked for a few months
I came up short a few fasteners, and managed to misplace my left clipon (feeling REALLY dumb about that) so 95% complete! Will hit the Honda shop the next day or so for a few bolts, and will continue to dig in the garage until I find the other bar
My friend re-tapped the wheels and put some nice, swanky titanium OZ bolts in they sent over for my troubles. Wheel is in, calipers are on and drag a little bit more then I'd like. We'll see what a slow half mile ride does for that.
Originally I'd just rattle canned that fender so it was all one color, but that dark gray front is starting to grow on me...
Using the 929 clipons at the moment, on top, with the forks only half way up the clipon. Seems to have plenty of fork to bite on so not worried about them coming off. Didn't want to skewer the geometry any more then necessary by pushing them to far up in the tree.
I recall the front axle not being flush on the left side when all together last time, so mildly concerned about the fact it is now. WIll investigate that a little more.
If this all checks out, I should be getting to the rear (which most likely will be easier!!!) next time we get a spat of bad weather
I came up short a few fasteners, and managed to misplace my left clipon (feeling REALLY dumb about that) so 95% complete! Will hit the Honda shop the next day or so for a few bolts, and will continue to dig in the garage until I find the other bar
My friend re-tapped the wheels and put some nice, swanky titanium OZ bolts in they sent over for my troubles. Wheel is in, calipers are on and drag a little bit more then I'd like. We'll see what a slow half mile ride does for that.
Originally I'd just rattle canned that fender so it was all one color, but that dark gray front is starting to grow on me...
Using the 929 clipons at the moment, on top, with the forks only half way up the clipon. Seems to have plenty of fork to bite on so not worried about them coming off. Didn't want to skewer the geometry any more then necessary by pushing them to far up in the tree.
I recall the front axle not being flush on the left side when all together last time, so mildly concerned about the fact it is now. WIll investigate that a little more.
If this all checks out, I should be getting to the rear (which most likely will be easier!!!) next time we get a spat of bad weather
05-14-2006, 06:59 PM
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Its getting there! So far, I'm VERY happy with the change! Ride is firmer, but not harsh. Handling is definately better with quicker turn in and less effort needed. Brakes are better too! Get more stopping power for my effort on the lever.
Weather looks good for the near future, so time to rack up some miles!
Weather looks good for the near future, so time to rack up some miles!
01-03-2007, 01:12 PM
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Bike will be heading to my friends place around next week so we can get going on the spacers. Painted the interior of my house, put down some pergo floors and did a bunch of work to the yard so haven't been wrenching much this year 
Soon to change I hope!
Soon to change I hope!
03-10-2009, 02:18 PM
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Back at it! I've taken care of all my other projects, and before the girlfriend makes me refinish the kitchen, my Hawk gets my undivided attention! Have a HID kit, undertail, CBR gauge set and a tail light mod on the way, and perhaps a paint job when its all together
I've tracked down the other parts needed for the rear wheel, just short bearings and the spacer. Since I'm using the Hawk axle, I'll need bearings with the inner diameter as the Hawk, but the outer of the SP1 wheels.
The Hawk uses 6204UU for the rear bearing 20mm inner, 47mm outer x 14mm depth
The RC51 uses a 6005 bearing, looks like 25mm inner, 47mm outer x 12mm depth
Would not having that extra 2mm of depth cause much a problem? Looks easy enough to swap out for stock Hawk bearings if thats the case!
I've taken care of all my other projects, and before the girlfriend makes me refinish the kitchen, my Hawk gets my undivided attention! Have a HID kit, undertail, CBR gauge set and a tail light mod on the way, and perhaps a paint job when its all together I've tracked down the other parts needed for the rear wheel, just short bearings and the spacer. Since I'm using the Hawk axle, I'll need bearings with the inner diameter as the Hawk, but the outer of the SP1 wheels.
The Hawk uses 6204UU for the rear bearing 20mm inner, 47mm outer x 14mm depth
The RC51 uses a 6005 bearing, looks like 25mm inner, 47mm outer x 12mm depth
Would not having that extra 2mm of depth cause much a problem? Looks easy enough to swap out for stock Hawk bearings if thats the case!
03-11-2009, 10:55 PM
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Hawk is up on stands and apart. Taking more measurements on the rear wheel. Bearings are the same size outer, so ordered a new set of Hawk bearings, and I'll just put those in the OZ wheel.
The spacer in the wheel I may be lucky on as well. Measuring through the wheel to the outer edges of the bearings, the Hawk is almost exactly 4mm wider then the OZ, and since the two bearings are 2mm narrower, the spacer may be the same length just a different diameter. Ordered another Hawk spacer, and will verify that when it arrives. Two parts easy anyway!
Now for the sprocket hub bit:
Very different from the Hawks, and the bearing here is a different size, and has that tubular metal insert that is the wrong diameter as well. For this it looks like I could have a machine shop just make me an insert that will bring the diameter down to the Hawk's axle size, then I just pop this right back on the wheel and go on my way.
Will call around tomorrow and see what my options are.
The spacer in the wheel I may be lucky on as well. Measuring through the wheel to the outer edges of the bearings, the Hawk is almost exactly 4mm wider then the OZ, and since the two bearings are 2mm narrower, the spacer may be the same length just a different diameter. Ordered another Hawk spacer, and will verify that when it arrives. Two parts easy anyway!
Now for the sprocket hub bit:
Very different from the Hawks, and the bearing here is a different size, and has that tubular metal insert that is the wrong diameter as well. For this it looks like I could have a machine shop just make me an insert that will bring the diameter down to the Hawk's axle size, then I just pop this right back on the wheel and go on my way.
Will call around tomorrow and see what my options are.
03-12-2009, 06:22 AM
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Good luck. I do not know enough about wheel bearings/loads etc to know the different issues to be concerned with here. I'm sure there is the expertise on the board somewhere that can address. Calling a local bearings shop will get you access to all bearings by spec so you can see if there is a correct OD/ID/Depth out there to similar load specs as the stock ones.
If there is a successful swap out there it will open up a whole set of options - particularly for those that have done the front end swap already so that wheel is just a direct replacement.
If there is a successful swap out there it will open up a whole set of options - particularly for those that have done the front end swap already so that wheel is just a direct replacement.
03-13-2009, 02:27 PM
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It looks like its just going to come down to a few easily made parts! Back from the shop where they knocked the bearings out of the old hawk wheel and the new OZ one. I'll get pics up when I get home, but the news is good.
Right side bearing is a straight swap if you want. Its the same OD, so the Hawk can drop right in.
Left side bearing for some odd reason (maybe just on the OZ) is quite a bit larger OD. Either an insert, or just buying a new bearing with the correct OD/ID will work. Mulling those options now.
The inner wheel spacer is about 1mm shorter on the Hawk then the OZ wheel (OZ is way fancier too, aluminium with 3 'edges'). A simple 1mm x 17mm spacer will fill the gap.
The sprocket carrier bearing is HUGE, lol! Honda put there own insert in it to bring it down to size, and we knocked that out so all I need is to take that to a machinist and have them make the exact same part, just 20mm ID instead of 25mm.
So total parts needed:
Custom insert for sprocket carrier bearing
Left side bearing with correct OD/ID OR insert
1mm spacer for inner-wheel spacer
Handful of 17mm ID spacers to center things up
Not so bad! Once I get a part made that works, I'll see if I can get the cad file to go with it and post it along with the bearing part #s.
Back from the shop where they knocked the bearings out of the old hawk wheel and the new OZ one. I'll get pics up when I get home, but the news is good.Right side bearing is a straight swap if you want. Its the same OD, so the Hawk can drop right in.
Left side bearing for some odd reason (maybe just on the OZ) is quite a bit larger OD. Either an insert, or just buying a new bearing with the correct OD/ID will work. Mulling those options now.
The inner wheel spacer is about 1mm shorter on the Hawk then the OZ wheel (OZ is way fancier too, aluminium with 3 'edges'). A simple 1mm x 17mm spacer will fill the gap.
The sprocket carrier bearing is HUGE, lol! Honda put there own insert in it to bring it down to size, and we knocked that out so all I need is to take that to a machinist and have them make the exact same part, just 20mm ID instead of 25mm.
So total parts needed:
Custom insert for sprocket carrier bearing
Left side bearing with correct OD/ID OR insert
1mm spacer for inner-wheel spacer
Handful of 17mm ID spacers to center things up
Not so bad! Once I get a part made that works, I'll see if I can get the cad file to go with it and post it along with the bearing part #s.
03-14-2009, 11:44 AM
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Really good actually, I may need no machining at all now
From the CBR sprocket carrier / OZ wheel side of things (sorry about large pics, easier to read!):
Guts of a Superhawk wheel, nothing new here:
Seriously bummed about the inner wheel spacer, .7mm short! I'll need to find a thiiiinnn washer to bridge that gap!
From the CBR sprocket carrier / OZ wheel side of things (sorry about large pics, easier to read!):
Guts of a Superhawk wheel, nothing new here:
Seriously bummed about the inner wheel spacer, .7mm short! I'll need to find a thiiiinnn washer to bridge that gap!
03-14-2009, 11:51 AM
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Looking at bearingsdirect.com:
Left OZ replacement : 20 x 14 x 47
http://bearingsdirect.com/store/inde...t_detail&p=232
Right OZ replacement : Superhawk bearing is the plan here, drops right in
CBR Sprocket bearing : 20 x 52 x 22.2
http://bearingsdirect.com/store/inde...t_detail&p=619
The nice thing about that one is the inner is 20mm, so the whole insert problem goes away altogether. Not sure why Honda even bothered unless they happened to have a few million laying around and the insert was cheaper then buying the right size?
Left OZ replacement : 20 x 14 x 47
http://bearingsdirect.com/store/inde...t_detail&p=232
Right OZ replacement : Superhawk bearing is the plan here, drops right in
CBR Sprocket bearing : 20 x 52 x 22.2
http://bearingsdirect.com/store/inde...t_detail&p=619
The nice thing about that one is the inner is 20mm, so the whole insert problem goes away altogether. Not sure why Honda even bothered unless they happened to have a few million laying around and the insert was cheaper then buying the right size?
03-18-2009, 12:59 PM
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Bearings have arrived! I'll start getting that together this evening with the spacer. Bike is torn to pieces for swingarm / frame painting, so may be the weekend before I get a chance to mount things up and start working on the alignment. Moving along!
I'll start getting that together this evening with the spacer. Bike is torn to pieces for swingarm / frame painting, so may be the weekend before I get a chance to mount things up and start working on the alignment. Moving along!
03-19-2009, 11:32 PM
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Behold!!
Do not adjust your monitor, what you are seeing is actually true. Several years after it began, before you sits an RC51 OZ HL-02 on a Superhawk axle
Its actually very easy, purely by luck it seems. The insert into the larger sprocket bearing had a 13mm extension on it, which is exactly the same size as one of the Hawk stock spacers, so that dropped right in the center of the cush drive.
The inner wheel spacer turned out to be a moot issue, they are BOTH longer then necessary. One of those bearings doesn't go all the way in, it comes up a mm or two short when it hits the spacer in the wheel. I'd wondered how Honda got that so exact, turns out they didn't
The smallest CBR 929 sprocket I could find was a 42 tooth, so 1 up from stock, doubt I'll notice.
The only two issues :
Dust seals are for a larger diameter axle, so won't do much. Fine for now, but will look into that for longetivity reasons.
I smushed one of the actual bearing seals (the metal one, VERY soft ) That isn't a perfect seal now, so will replace that sometime soon, but should be OK for a bit.
Last bit to do is get it all centered up, which I'll get moving on as soon as the swingarm / subframe and exhaust are dry!
Do not adjust your monitor, what you are seeing is actually true. Several years after it began, before you sits an RC51 OZ HL-02 on a Superhawk axle
Its actually very easy, purely by luck it seems. The insert into the larger sprocket bearing had a 13mm extension on it, which is exactly the same size as one of the Hawk stock spacers, so that dropped right in the center of the cush drive.
The inner wheel spacer turned out to be a moot issue, they are BOTH longer then necessary. One of those bearings doesn't go all the way in, it comes up a mm or two short when it hits the spacer in the wheel. I'd wondered how Honda got that so exact, turns out they didn't
The smallest CBR 929 sprocket I could find was a 42 tooth, so 1 up from stock, doubt I'll notice.
The only two issues :
Dust seals are for a larger diameter axle, so won't do much. Fine for now, but will look into that for longetivity reasons.
I smushed one of the actual bearing seals (the metal one, VERY soft
) That isn't a perfect seal now, so will replace that sometime soon, but should be OK for a bit.Last bit to do is get it all centered up, which I'll get moving on as soon as the swingarm / subframe and exhaust are dry!
