Correcting my stupid Mistake with timing!!!!!!
03-22-2009, 07:13 AM
#1
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Correcting my stupid Mistake with timing!!!!!!
SO i think I figured out how to correct the issue of me jumping a bunch of teeth on my cct install. ( see my other post from yesterday).
1. since I basically mimmicked a cct failure at 1-2 rpm, the lobes are touching the valves.
2. I figure I can take the cams off
3. I can then find TDC for the rear off the crank
4. I can reinstall the cams based on the correct timing marks
5. reinstall the cam chain and properly set the CCT.
Is this a viable fix or am i on crack. I saw as lazn showed in the manual, but wanted run it past everyone.
P.S. Dont be a dumb *** like me and screw with your cct's when their fine.
1. since I basically mimmicked a cct failure at 1-2 rpm, the lobes are touching the valves.
2. I figure I can take the cams off
3. I can then find TDC for the rear off the crank
4. I can reinstall the cams based on the correct timing marks
5. reinstall the cam chain and properly set the CCT.
Is this a viable fix or am i on crack. I saw as lazn showed in the manual, but wanted run it past everyone.
P.S. Dont be a dumb *** like me and screw with your cct's when their fine.
03-22-2009, 07:59 AM
#2
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Squid
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When checking for TDC at the crank you can be at either TDC compression or TDC overlap. By looking at the crank you can't tell were you are overlap or compression. To set your CCT's you need to be on the compression stroke, at that point there is no tension on the cam chain as the lobes of the cam are not in contact with the lifters.
All this may sound very basic but not knowing were your engine is in the 4 stroke cycle can be very expensive, bent valves, lots of labor, weeks of not riding.
Hopefully this helps. I modified my CCT's so they can't retract if the spring fails and am using the factory CCT's. No adjustments necessary. Search for CCT redo and there are pictures of the spring failure and modification.
Mark
All this may sound very basic but not knowing were your engine is in the 4 stroke cycle can be very expensive, bent valves, lots of labor, weeks of not riding.
Hopefully this helps. I modified my CCT's so they can't retract if the spring fails and am using the factory CCT's. No adjustments necessary. Search for CCT redo and there are pictures of the spring failure and modification.
Mark
03-22-2009, 08:22 AM
#3
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SuperSport
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If you are doing both heads, the power or exhaust stroke are not that important, but the rear need to be 3/4 turn counterclockwise from the front.
The hawk will fire every cylinder every crank turn anyway since they went for cheapo wasted spark.
Assuming that the front is set at TDC, turn the engine CC 270° until you line up the RT mark, place the cams like this
If you have a cam off, (CCT is loose, chain guide not installed yet) pull one link on the sprocket from the side you want it to go and hook it on the cam sprocket, the chain will form a little triangle, push it all the way around the other side, bingo easy one tooth move, repeat until all lined up, tension the chain and rotate the engine two turns, if it comes back right on put the chain guide on, torque the cams to spec if not done already, measure clearances while in there.
If you feel any bolt ain't getting any tighter while you torque them, sort of torque peak, back them off and get new ones, you are bound for an ugly failure, the threads stretch close to the shank and get thinner making the bolt a timebomb.
The hawk will fire every cylinder every crank turn anyway since they went for cheapo wasted spark.
Assuming that the front is set at TDC, turn the engine CC 270° until you line up the RT mark, place the cams like this
If you have a cam off, (CCT is loose, chain guide not installed yet) pull one link on the sprocket from the side you want it to go and hook it on the cam sprocket, the chain will form a little triangle, push it all the way around the other side, bingo easy one tooth move, repeat until all lined up, tension the chain and rotate the engine two turns, if it comes back right on put the chain guide on, torque the cams to spec if not done already, measure clearances while in there.
If you feel any bolt ain't getting any tighter while you torque them, sort of torque peak, back them off and get new ones, you are bound for an ugly failure, the threads stretch close to the shank and get thinner making the bolt a timebomb.
Last edited by gboezio; 03-22-2009 at 08:26 AM.
03-22-2009, 09:40 AM
#5
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Well just set to RT, loosen the CCT, remove the chain guard, walk the chain link by link until the cam is right, then do the other, put back the chain guide, tension the CCT, check alignment, three turn by hands, then you are done.
No need to take the cams off unless the valve clearances are bad.
No need to take the cams off unless the valve clearances are bad.
03-22-2009, 03:07 PM
#8
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I pulled the chian off the sprockets and was able to get the marks to RT on the crank.
I then moved each cam to the proper RI and RE marks. NOW I cant get the chain back on... Any tips to do this. I can get the rear on but the front has a guide of some sort that I cant get in front of to put the chain on.
I then moved each cam to the proper RI and RE marks. NOW I cant get the chain back on... Any tips to do this. I can get the rear on but the front has a guide of some sort that I cant get in front of to put the chain on.
03-22-2009, 06:02 PM
#10
Will drum for BBQ
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My chain would not come off the sprockets to rotate one. I ended up pulling one of the cam sprockets and moving it the number of links in the chain I needed, then hooking it back up to the cam. Lot easier than pulling cams.
03-22-2009, 08:32 PM
#11
jet wrench
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Don't know who came up with pulling cams... silly.
LB
03-23-2009, 05:38 AM
#12
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SuperSport
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No one said to pull a cam.
The easiest way is to skip it link by link, but if you take off the sprocket, I strongly advise you to get a torque wrench to put it back together, failure of these bolts are as bad as a CCT failure and they stretch like butter.
The easiest way is to skip it link by link, but if you take off the sprocket, I strongly advise you to get a torque wrench to put it back together, failure of these bolts are as bad as a CCT failure and they stretch like butter.
03-23-2009, 06:52 AM
#13
Will drum for BBQ
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Wouldn't skip. Believe me, I tried every way possible. I think a lot has to do with the amount of cam chain stretch.
I didn't have a problem with the cam sprocket bolts, but the center cam chain guard bolt snapped at the proper torque. There was enough sticking out to remove it and replace with another.
03-23-2009, 07:01 AM
#14
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You are probably right for the stretch, maybe mine is a slacker and easier to walk around the sprocket, add to that the tensioner chain guide wear.
Then take the sprocket off and rotate the cams, check it with the bolt finger tight, so you torque them once.
These bolts are like butter, good thing/bad thing, with a good stretch they are not likely to fall off, but so easy to overtorque, you could go at least a full turn before they snap, but you feel the torque peaking (not getting tighter as you turn), bolt is junk already.
Hate them probably because I have a 10-100 lb/ft TW, I'm in the market for a smaller one.
Then take the sprocket off and rotate the cams, check it with the bolt finger tight, so you torque them once.
These bolts are like butter, good thing/bad thing, with a good stretch they are not likely to fall off, but so easy to overtorque, you could go at least a full turn before they snap, but you feel the torque peaking (not getting tighter as you turn), bolt is junk already.
Hate them probably because I have a 10-100 lb/ft TW, I'm in the market for a smaller one.
03-23-2009, 07:56 PM
#15
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Alright, I got the chain back on both sprockets. I also took the front cam cover off to check the front and all was fine.
I am in the process of putting everything back together.
I am in the process of putting everything back together.
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