Question
02-14-2014, 08:57 PM
#1
evil man of nothing
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Question
This question has bothered me for quite awhile and Nicky Hayden's latest test lap times have me wondering what you all think. Why do such talented riders like Hayden, Spies, Edwards, (and now Crutchlow) etc. prefer to do parade laps in MotoGP rather than take a winning ride in World Superbike? Can the money difference and prestige of just being there really be worth it? Again it's just my opinion but I imagine Max Biaggi didn't feel too bad about winning a couple more WSBK titles instead of riding parade laps on an uncompetitive bike (and I'm sure Aprilia payed him handsomely). It's been frustrating the last few years to see such talented guys (especially the American riders because they're all former world champions) who have hardly any chance of winning or even competing for a win largely because of the equipment they're riding. I'm an ex-baseball player but I just don't see MotoGP vs WSBK the same as comparing say AAA to the major leagues. I know these guys know they have a limited shelf life and can't do this forever, so many will take the money while they can. What do you all think?
02-14-2014, 09:38 PM
#2
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The big money is in GP, but i would guess that it is more about the contract terms and conditions that makes up the riders mind, non of us know the exact details of the contracts, as such I wouldn't judge why they prefer the parade at the GP, I can tell you one thing though, I wouldn't mind parading the GP as well :-)
02-14-2014, 10:04 PM
#3
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"do such talented riders like Hayden, Spies, Edwards, (and now Crutchlow) etc. prefer to do parade laps in MotoGP rather than take a winning ride in World Superbike?"
if a rider could consistently win in one race series, and not in another then the talent level and equipment is on a higher plane. If you could consistently be the fastest rider in your local race organization, but once you stepped into another organization you usually placed 4th or 5th, wouldnt you want to try and improve to be the fastest there as well? i understand that in motorcycle racing, equipment is a huge factor in winning races. hence why rossi, hayden, etc did so poorly with ducati as apposed to winning championships with Honda and Yamaha, so if you dont have the right people and equipment with your team youll never do well. but i think its about challenging themselves. I think the prestige of MotoGP is greater than WSBK. alot of the times WSBK is more exciting and i favor it over MotoGP some seasons. but i think winning the championship in motogp is like being THE worlds fastest. or at least people perceive it that way so thats what everyone wants to win. MotoGP is like the formula1 of bikes. i think money plays a big part and also the worldwide recognition. just my 2 cents
if a rider could consistently win in one race series, and not in another then the talent level and equipment is on a higher plane. If you could consistently be the fastest rider in your local race organization, but once you stepped into another organization you usually placed 4th or 5th, wouldnt you want to try and improve to be the fastest there as well? i understand that in motorcycle racing, equipment is a huge factor in winning races. hence why rossi, hayden, etc did so poorly with ducati as apposed to winning championships with Honda and Yamaha, so if you dont have the right people and equipment with your team youll never do well. but i think its about challenging themselves. I think the prestige of MotoGP is greater than WSBK. alot of the times WSBK is more exciting and i favor it over MotoGP some seasons. but i think winning the championship in motogp is like being THE worlds fastest. or at least people perceive it that way so thats what everyone wants to win. MotoGP is like the formula1 of bikes. i think money plays a big part and also the worldwide recognition. just my 2 cents
02-15-2014, 01:35 AM
#5
evil man of nothing
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02-15-2014, 02:55 AM
#6
erno
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02-15-2014, 04:37 PM
#7
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Captain,
It's funny you should mention Colin Edwards and WSB racing. I was just enjoying some you-tube of he and Troy Bayliss from 2002 WSB and this is the e-mail that I just sent to my Bro last week.
Thanks for posting. Check out the link if you get a chance...
"Superbike 2002 Imola. Colin Edwards on a factory Honda VTR 1000 SP2 and Troy Bayliss riding the factory Ducati 998. This is some of the best racing I have seen, you can see that both guys are sliding both ends and right at the edge... Amazing"
It's funny you should mention Colin Edwards and WSB racing. I was just enjoying some you-tube of he and Troy Bayliss from 2002 WSB and this is the e-mail that I just sent to my Bro last week.
Thanks for posting. Check out the link if you get a chance...
"Superbike 2002 Imola. Colin Edwards on a factory Honda VTR 1000 SP2 and Troy Bayliss riding the factory Ducati 998. This is some of the best racing I have seen, you can see that both guys are sliding both ends and right at the edge... Amazing"
02-15-2014, 07:36 PM
#9
evil man of nothing
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It definitely was. I remember sitting on the edge of my seat watching it live-doesn't seem like that long ago. Amazing stuff. Doesn't get much better than that.
Last edited by captainchaos; 02-15-2014 at 07:44 PM.
02-16-2014, 05:33 AM
#11
evil man of nothing
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Well, live on TV ( I mean there may have been a delay or whatever) not in person. But speed channel used to actually go out of their way to show stuff like this.
02-16-2014, 06:25 AM
#13
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I think as been said its not so much about winning as the competition.
I race Nitro R/C 1/8th scale buggies, and I can win the sportsman class, I normally have to fight for it, but I normally end up winning it in the last few laps of the race. I would rather end up in the middle of the pack in pro than run sportsman though. How good does it feel to say I'm the fastest of the slow guys when you can say I can hang with the best of them even with B grade equipment? what does it say about you to just hang back and win races you know you can win when there is a chance you can end up on the podium by some chance on the higher level
I race Nitro R/C 1/8th scale buggies, and I can win the sportsman class, I normally have to fight for it, but I normally end up winning it in the last few laps of the race. I would rather end up in the middle of the pack in pro than run sportsman though. How good does it feel to say I'm the fastest of the slow guys when you can say I can hang with the best of them even with B grade equipment? what does it say about you to just hang back and win races you know you can win when there is a chance you can end up on the podium by some chance on the higher level
02-16-2014, 04:05 PM
#14
evil man of nothing
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I think as been said its not so much about winning as the competition.
I race Nitro R/C 1/8th scale buggies, and I can win the sportsman class, I normally have to fight for it, but I normally end up winning it in the last few laps of the race. I would rather end up in the middle of the pack in pro than run sportsman though. How good does it feel to say I'm the fastest of the slow guys when you can say I can hang with the best of them even with B grade equipment? what does it say about you to just hang back and win races you know you can win when there is a chance you can end up on the podium by some chance on the higher level
I race Nitro R/C 1/8th scale buggies, and I can win the sportsman class, I normally have to fight for it, but I normally end up winning it in the last few laps of the race. I would rather end up in the middle of the pack in pro than run sportsman though. How good does it feel to say I'm the fastest of the slow guys when you can say I can hang with the best of them even with B grade equipment? what does it say about you to just hang back and win races you know you can win when there is a chance you can end up on the podium by some chance on the higher level
02-16-2014, 05:46 PM
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02-16-2014, 07:55 PM
#16
evil man of nothing
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02-16-2014, 09:36 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by Tweety 
"I saw it live, on location... 
I rode down on the VTR, along with a bunch of friends..."
That had to have been one item crossed off the bucket list. Way cool.
I wonder how the guys that I grew up watching on 2-stroke 500's would fair on today's electronic wonder machines. I'm taking about Kenny Roberts, Mick Doohan, Freddie Spencer, Eddie Lawson, Wayne Rainey, Wayne Gardner, and others. What an incredible handful those 500's were. I have a feeling they would have faired well with the likes of Rossi and Marquez. But no doubt all of these guys past and present are at a totally different level.
I have to think that the differences in total $ available to factory teams in engineering and R&D between WSBK and MotoGP play a large part in just how much better those machines are. I am not dismissing the differences in raw talent between WSBK and MotoGP. I can't speculate on whether or not it is machines or talent or both that make the biggest difference.
"I saw it live, on location... I rode down on the VTR, along with a bunch of friends..."That had to have been one item crossed off the bucket list. Way cool.
I wonder how the guys that I grew up watching on 2-stroke 500's would fair on today's electronic wonder machines. I'm taking about Kenny Roberts, Mick Doohan, Freddie Spencer, Eddie Lawson, Wayne Rainey, Wayne Gardner, and others. What an incredible handful those 500's were. I have a feeling they would have faired well with the likes of Rossi and Marquez. But no doubt all of these guys past and present are at a totally different level.
I have to think that the differences in total $ available to factory teams in engineering and R&D between WSBK and MotoGP play a large part in just how much better those machines are. I am not dismissing the differences in raw talent between WSBK and MotoGP. I can't speculate on whether or not it is machines or talent or both that make the biggest difference.
02-17-2014, 05:10 AM
#18
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I sat on the grandstands on top of Curve Aqua minerali, so I had a decent view down over four-five curves, from the entry of Curva Piratella, to exiting Aqua Minerali... No view of the finish line unfortunately, but a set of curves where a whole lot of action was taking place...
02-17-2014, 08:06 AM
#19
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If I was racing, that's where I would want to be.. well I am getting into racing, but I'm going to be losing at the bottom level so where I wan't to be is a moot point
Edit: Also the MotoGP bikes have a steeper lean angle than WSBK bikes have, that just means more fun to me, who wants to drag knee when you could drag elbow
02-17-2014, 01:16 PM
#20
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Captain Chaos, with all due respect if you took Marquez,Pedrosa and Lorenzo on Superbikes they would lap the field through about 10th.
I love WSBK but the fact of the matter it's the B team. A place where retired MotoGP riders go to line their pockets with a few million more Euro's before they retire. Witness Max Biaggi, Carlos Checa, Pier Francisco Chili and a few more.
In fact you can make the argument that you can be competitive in WSBK into your 40's but you're sure as hell done in MotoGP somewhere north of 30!
I love WSBK but the fact of the matter it's the B team. A place where retired MotoGP riders go to line their pockets with a few million more Euro's before they retire. Witness Max Biaggi, Carlos Checa, Pier Francisco Chili and a few more.
In fact you can make the argument that you can be competitive in WSBK into your 40's but you're sure as hell done in MotoGP somewhere north of 30!
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