Why Israel will never go back to the 67' lines...
05-25-2011, 09:53 PM
#1
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Why Israel will never go back to the 67' lines...
05-25-2011, 10:26 PM
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05-25-2011, 10:45 PM
#4
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I was on active duty in the USN in 1967 when the 6 Day War occurred. Obviously there was a lot of other **** going on (Vietnam) but the Israeli's were so nervous and trigger happy, they even hit one of our ships, the USS Liberty, in the Mediterranean with a rocket fired from a fighter plane.
That was close to home, since the Liberty (like the USS Pueblo, captured the next year by the North Koreans) was attached to Naval Security Group, of which I was a member. I was a CT3 at the time.
I'm not Jewish, but we understood at that time that the Israeli's were under quite a bit of duress, and they made a huge mistake. Or so it was reported.
If Obama wants Israel to go back to pre-1967 borders, wouldn't Netanyahu be justified to tell Obama that the USA should go back to pre-1845 borders and give the American Southwest back to Mexico?
I know Obama backpeddled the next day, but he said it, and I heard it.
That was close to home, since the Liberty (like the USS Pueblo, captured the next year by the North Koreans) was attached to Naval Security Group, of which I was a member. I was a CT3 at the time.
I'm not Jewish, but we understood at that time that the Israeli's were under quite a bit of duress, and they made a huge mistake. Or so it was reported.
If Obama wants Israel to go back to pre-1967 borders, wouldn't Netanyahu be justified to tell Obama that the USA should go back to pre-1845 borders and give the American Southwest back to Mexico?
I know Obama backpeddled the next day, but he said it, and I heard it.
05-25-2011, 10:49 PM
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I was on active duty in the USN in 1967 when the 6 Day War occurred. Obviously there was a lot of other **** going on (Vietnam) but the Israeli's were so nervous and trigger happy, they even hit one of our ships, the USS Liberty, in the Mediterranean with a rocket fired from a fighter plane.
That was close to home, since the Liberty (like the USS Pueblo, captured the next year by the North Koreans) was attached to Naval Security Group, of which I was a member. I was a CT3 at the time.
I'm not Jewish, but we understood at that time that the Israeli's were under quite a bit of duress, and they made a huge mistake. Or so it was reported.
If Obama wants Israel to go back to pre-1967 borders, wouldn't Netanyahu be justified to tell Obama that the USA should go back to pre-1845 borders and give the American Southwest back to Mexico?
I know Obama backpeddled the next day, but he said it, and I heard it.
That was close to home, since the Liberty (like the USS Pueblo, captured the next year by the North Koreans) was attached to Naval Security Group, of which I was a member. I was a CT3 at the time.
I'm not Jewish, but we understood at that time that the Israeli's were under quite a bit of duress, and they made a huge mistake. Or so it was reported.
If Obama wants Israel to go back to pre-1967 borders, wouldn't Netanyahu be justified to tell Obama that the USA should go back to pre-1845 borders and give the American Southwest back to Mexico?
I know Obama backpeddled the next day, but he said it, and I heard it.
05-26-2011, 05:19 AM
#6
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Bottom line is Obama is not a friend to Israel. He wants them wiped out of that area of the world just like every other muslim. Dont forget he was raised muslim and only "converted" when he felt it would help his political carreer. I guarantee when no one is looking he kneels toward Mecca every day.
05-26-2011, 05:22 AM
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I was on active duty in the USN in 1967 when the 6 Day War occurred. Obviously there was a lot of other **** going on (Vietnam) but the Israeli's were so nervous and trigger happy, they even hit one of our ships, the USS Liberty, in the Mediterranean with a rocket fired from a fighter plane.
That was close to home, since the Liberty (like the USS Pueblo, captured the next year by the North Koreans) was attached to Naval Security Group, of which I was a member. I was a CT3 at the time.
I'm not Jewish, but we understood at that time that the Israeli's were under quite a bit of duress, and they made a huge mistake. Or so it was reported.
If Obama wants Israel to go back to pre-1967 borders, wouldn't Netanyahu be justified to tell Obama that the USA should go back to pre-1845 borders and give the American Southwest back to Mexico?
I know Obama backpeddled the next day, but he said it, and I heard it.
That was close to home, since the Liberty (like the USS Pueblo, captured the next year by the North Koreans) was attached to Naval Security Group, of which I was a member. I was a CT3 at the time.
I'm not Jewish, but we understood at that time that the Israeli's were under quite a bit of duress, and they made a huge mistake. Or so it was reported.
If Obama wants Israel to go back to pre-1967 borders, wouldn't Netanyahu be justified to tell Obama that the USA should go back to pre-1845 borders and give the American Southwest back to Mexico?
I know Obama backpeddled the next day, but he said it, and I heard it.
05-26-2011, 06:58 AM
#11
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Anybody who believes the left or right has a monopoly on "truth"in the mideast is a fool. Also, I suggest a review of the period between 1945 and 1948 and the UN's decision would be in order. There are no clean hands in this dispute. This is a tribal blood feud and both sides think that they are righteous and their God is on their side. Toss in our oil under their sand and "truth" is out the window.
05-26-2011, 07:21 AM
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Anybody who believes the left or right has a monopoly on "truth"in the mideast is a fool. Also, I suggest a review of the period between 1945 and 1948 and the UN's decision would be in order. There are no clean hands in this dispute. This is a tribal blood feud and both sides think that they are righteous and their God is on their side. Toss in our oil under their sand and "truth" is out the window.
tribal blood feud or not. Jews arent flying planes into our buildings. Ill stand with Israel.
05-26-2011, 10:28 AM
#14
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Remember the live video feed from the mideast on 9/11? The Palistinians rushed out into their streets cheering and waving their arms in the air.
Wonderful human values that.
Obama a muslim? I don't care. And I don't care what god you pray to, doubt you'll get a response. (How did that rapture thing work?) Pick your religion, ain't about redemption, its about power and social control. And money.
The crucible of the holocaust left the Arabs with a really tough nut to crack in Israel. Wonder if they can be smart enough to make the best of the situation.
Wonderful human values that.
Obama a muslim? I don't care. And I don't care what god you pray to, doubt you'll get a response. (How did that rapture thing work?) Pick your religion, ain't about redemption, its about power and social control. And money.
The crucible of the holocaust left the Arabs with a really tough nut to crack in Israel. Wonder if they can be smart enough to make the best of the situation.
05-26-2011, 01:52 PM
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But they do control Hollywood
They are the ONLY democracy in the region. One of the key reasons people hate the US is because our leaders chart foreign policy based on the direction of the wind instead of the conviction of our principles.
I'm not suggesting everyone would love us if we supported democracies but I would feel better about what we do in the world if we stuck to a set of principles.
05-27-2011, 10:46 AM
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Additionally, I don't maintain a simplistic, "everything is either black or white" outlook on life.
Mel Gibson doesn't look Muslim...neither do most neo-*****.
05-27-2011, 11:53 AM
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Mel Gibson is Catholic and neo-***** are well......just morons.
05-27-2011, 01:31 PM
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Remember who used that foreign aid to take-out Saddam Husein's nuclear reactor while we were equipping him against the Iranian's, long before he became a menace to the world and invaded Kuwait.
The Israeli's have almost always had our backs despite how the US non-Jewish government heads (and to a limited extent our general population) treated the "Jewish problem" during and after WW2. The US secretary of war knew about the death camps (as did W. Churchill) but would not divert 1 bomber to disrupt the railroad system leading to the camps. After the war they created quotas for Jewish immigration but not for other religions or nationalities; including Italians and Germans! The US did support Israeli independence in the UN vote but refused, along with the rest of the world, to provide even humanitarian aid (let alone arms, planes and other military equipment) when 7 Arab countries attacked Israel immediately after their independence. In fact the British trained & equipped the Trans-Jordan (as it was called in 1948) army and air force, and when the Brits pulled out they handed over their arsenal to the Jordanians.
The Israelis did our dirty work in 1956 when Nasser got in bed with the Soviets and closed the Suez Canal; then we made them give it all back. Same in 1967 but this time the Israeli's said "no way". Not when a Syrian was able to roll a hand grenade down a Golan Heights mountain into some Kibutznik's backyard, or a Lebanese could lob a shell down the road, the Jordanian's did not allow a Jew into Jerusalem (the holiest place in the world for Jews when the Muslims have Mecca, Medina and many other holy sites but the Israelis have never restricted access to the Dome of the Rock, etc) from 1948 to 1967 when the Israeli's "took it back", and the Egyptian's made a mockery of their common borders. The Catholic church also never said a word in WW2 or after when the Jewish DPs had no where to go afterward.
Bottom line, I'd rather keep helping the Israelis than trust any Arab state given their precarious internal issues. When the Egyptians threw out Mubarak and were dancing in the streets, did you hear what they did to the South African-US television reporter? Its not a macho thing with Israelis, its do whatever it takes to stay alive. As it has been since the destruction of the 2nd temple and the diaspora began....
Last edited by skokievtr; 05-27-2011 at 01:36 PM.
05-28-2011, 09:27 AM
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Remember who used that foreign aid to take-out Saddam Husein's nuclear reactor while we were equipping him against the Iranian's, long before he became a menace to the world and invaded Kuwait.
The Israeli's have almost always had our backs despite how the US non-Jewish government heads (and to a limited extent our general population) treated the "Jewish problem" during and after WW2. The US secretary of war knew about the death camps (as did W. Churchill) but would not divert 1 bomber to disrupt the railroad system leading to the camps. After the war they created quotas for Jewish immigration but not for other religions or nationalities; including Italians and Germans! The US did support Israeli independence in the UN vote but refused, along with the rest of the world, to provide even humanitarian aid (let alone arms, planes and other military equipment) when 7 Arab countries attacked Israel immediately after their independence. In fact the British trained & equipped the Trans-Jordan (as it was called in 1948) army and air force, and when the Brits pulled out they handed over their arsenal to the Jordanians.
The Israelis did our dirty work in 1956 when Nasser got in bed with the Soviets and closed the Suez Canal; then we made them give it all back. Same in 1967 but this time the Israeli's said "no way". Not when a Syrian was able to roll a hand grenade down a Golan Heights mountain into some Kibutznik's backyard, or a Lebanese could lob a shell down the road, the Jordanian's did not allow a Jew into Jerusalem (the holiest place in the world for Jews when the Muslims have Mecca, Medina and many other holy sites but the Israelis have never restricted access to the Dome of the Rock, etc) from 1948 to 1967 when the Israeli's "took it back", and the Egyptian's made a mockery of their common borders. The Catholic church also never said a word in WW2 or after when the Jewish DPs had no where to go afterward.
Bottom line, I'd rather keep helping the Israelis than trust any Arab state given their precarious internal issues. When the Egyptians threw out Mubarak and were dancing in the streets, did you hear what they did to the South African-US television reporter? Its not a macho thing with Israelis, its do whatever it takes to stay alive. As it has been since the destruction of the 2nd temple and the diaspora began....
The Israeli's have almost always had our backs despite how the US non-Jewish government heads (and to a limited extent our general population) treated the "Jewish problem" during and after WW2. The US secretary of war knew about the death camps (as did W. Churchill) but would not divert 1 bomber to disrupt the railroad system leading to the camps. After the war they created quotas for Jewish immigration but not for other religions or nationalities; including Italians and Germans! The US did support Israeli independence in the UN vote but refused, along with the rest of the world, to provide even humanitarian aid (let alone arms, planes and other military equipment) when 7 Arab countries attacked Israel immediately after their independence. In fact the British trained & equipped the Trans-Jordan (as it was called in 1948) army and air force, and when the Brits pulled out they handed over their arsenal to the Jordanians.
The Israelis did our dirty work in 1956 when Nasser got in bed with the Soviets and closed the Suez Canal; then we made them give it all back. Same in 1967 but this time the Israeli's said "no way". Not when a Syrian was able to roll a hand grenade down a Golan Heights mountain into some Kibutznik's backyard, or a Lebanese could lob a shell down the road, the Jordanian's did not allow a Jew into Jerusalem (the holiest place in the world for Jews when the Muslims have Mecca, Medina and many other holy sites but the Israelis have never restricted access to the Dome of the Rock, etc) from 1948 to 1967 when the Israeli's "took it back", and the Egyptian's made a mockery of their common borders. The Catholic church also never said a word in WW2 or after when the Jewish DPs had no where to go afterward.
Bottom line, I'd rather keep helping the Israelis than trust any Arab state given their precarious internal issues. When the Egyptians threw out Mubarak and were dancing in the streets, did you hear what they did to the South African-US television reporter? Its not a macho thing with Israelis, its do whatever it takes to stay alive. As it has been since the destruction of the 2nd temple and the diaspora began....
05-28-2011, 12:11 PM
#20
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I do not believe the Israelis are anyone's lackey. However, unlike very often with the US military, the Israelis decide what needs to be done and do it right the first time, as they know in life there second chances are rarely feasible.
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