I'm a dumba$$ who lowsided....
09-02-2007, 10:12 PM
#1
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Squid
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 99
I'm a dumba$$ who lowsided....
Turn 9 at Pacific today (Kent, WA). First time out I was dragging the feelers on the foot pegs, and a CR said to just take them off. 2nd time out towards the end of the session, I was coming around turn 9, Im pretty sure I was off the seat enough, but probably not. A CR behind said he didnt notice anything out of the ordinary, so maybe I was off the seat enough.
If I scraped the pegs (first session) I could feel my foot move up. But this time, I didnt feel anything with my foot, but heard a scrape, heard the engine rev and I knew it was off the ground, didnt even have time to say %^&%$% and I was on the tarmac.
I ended up face down, felt the burn on my stomach (road rash), and managed to roll on my back. I have, ooppps, make that past tense, ~had~ a 2 piece Joe Rocket suit. The jacket lifted/tore up, so I got a hand sized road rash on my stomach. And the right elbow of the jacket went through. I have a quarter size road rash there.
My pants, the left leg ripped out at the seam, it was open from just below the crotch to just below the knee. I got a silver dollar sized road rash on my knee, about a small hand sized road rash on my thigh and it already started turning purple, so I think thats where the bike landed. And a twisted ankle that the ER put a splint on. (yes its thobbing, but the stomach rash just plain hurts. and yes I scrubbed it in the shower, ZOMG that frikkin HURT)
The boots are surprisingly scratch free. A few scratches on both toes, about half were there before.
The bike suffered a hole in the left side engine case/cover. I will have to assume that dirt got in there, so I will take it all apart and rebuild it. It will have to be over the winter, due to a recent death in the family and 2 trips back to NY, then a 7.5K dental bill for my teeth/bridge, Im totally maxed on my cards/bank/etc. The controls levers need replacing, the clutch broke. L front turn signal, R footpeg, left exhaust pipe, muffler mounts Left side. The fairing seemed to make it out ok, some scratches and a crack where the turn signal broke. Tomorrow I will try to get a closer look.
No pics yet, the camera battery is dead, so I will have to do that tomorrow to.
Ive been going over and over in my mind to try to figgure out what I did. I'm concluding I wasnt leaned out enough. Whats strange is that I didnt feel my foot move first. But heard the scraping and the motor rev and then pavement. So I think I must not have been leaned out enough.
I learned that I NEED a 1 piece leather suit. no more 2 piece suits. Dianese back protectors work. I need race boots. No scratches on the hemet, managed to keep my head up. I wear a neck protector, those rings that dirt bike riders wear, It kept my head from flopping around, best $40 bucks I ever spent. It paid for itself many times over today. Get one.
Oh, the "Hi honey, I lowsided the bike today" did NOT go over very well. After the expected crying, "your going to kill yourself", your not gonna ride bikes anymore, she told me she was going to sell all the bikes and buy me a "Hoveround Scooter"
If I scraped the pegs (first session) I could feel my foot move up. But this time, I didnt feel anything with my foot, but heard a scrape, heard the engine rev and I knew it was off the ground, didnt even have time to say %^&%$% and I was on the tarmac.
I ended up face down, felt the burn on my stomach (road rash), and managed to roll on my back. I have, ooppps, make that past tense, ~had~ a 2 piece Joe Rocket suit. The jacket lifted/tore up, so I got a hand sized road rash on my stomach. And the right elbow of the jacket went through. I have a quarter size road rash there.
My pants, the left leg ripped out at the seam, it was open from just below the crotch to just below the knee. I got a silver dollar sized road rash on my knee, about a small hand sized road rash on my thigh and it already started turning purple, so I think thats where the bike landed. And a twisted ankle that the ER put a splint on. (yes its thobbing, but the stomach rash just plain hurts. and yes I scrubbed it in the shower, ZOMG that frikkin HURT)
The boots are surprisingly scratch free. A few scratches on both toes, about half were there before.
The bike suffered a hole in the left side engine case/cover. I will have to assume that dirt got in there, so I will take it all apart and rebuild it. It will have to be over the winter, due to a recent death in the family and 2 trips back to NY, then a 7.5K dental bill for my teeth/bridge, Im totally maxed on my cards/bank/etc. The controls levers need replacing, the clutch broke. L front turn signal, R footpeg, left exhaust pipe, muffler mounts Left side. The fairing seemed to make it out ok, some scratches and a crack where the turn signal broke. Tomorrow I will try to get a closer look.
No pics yet, the camera battery is dead, so I will have to do that tomorrow to.
Ive been going over and over in my mind to try to figgure out what I did. I'm concluding I wasnt leaned out enough. Whats strange is that I didnt feel my foot move first. But heard the scraping and the motor rev and then pavement. So I think I must not have been leaned out enough.
I learned that I NEED a 1 piece leather suit. no more 2 piece suits. Dianese back protectors work. I need race boots. No scratches on the hemet, managed to keep my head up. I wear a neck protector, those rings that dirt bike riders wear, It kept my head from flopping around, best $40 bucks I ever spent. It paid for itself many times over today. Get one.
Oh, the "Hi honey, I lowsided the bike today" did NOT go over very well. After the expected crying, "your going to kill yourself", your not gonna ride bikes anymore, she told me she was going to sell all the bikes and buy me a "Hoveround Scooter"
09-02-2007, 10:29 PM
#2
Hmm?
SuperBike
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: San Gabriel Valley
Posts: 2,069
Ouch!! Sorry to hear about the 2piece falling apart on ya. What model JR 2piece were you wearing?
I've had that wife-speech MANY times. Falling off my Superhawk at the track, getting hit by a truck, then tearing my ankle ligaments in a SuMo incident....the list just goes on.
I've had that wife-speech MANY times. Falling off my Superhawk at the track, getting hit by a truck, then tearing my ankle ligaments in a SuMo incident....the list just goes on.
09-03-2007, 08:20 AM
#4
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Phoenix, formerly Dallas
Posts: 141
Wow that sucks! I did my first track day on August 20th and started feeling my feet pop up a little as the 2" feelers started dragging. I asked one of the experienced instructors if I should yank them and he said that those are often markers...that they are a "warning" that you are about to hit "hard" parts...things that won't move. I thought I remembered a forum posting that after pegs the next to hit is the stock exhuast, then the sidestand. I have high mounts and didn't zip tie the sidestand so it had a little room to move up.
That being said, I left the feelers on until I could find out from the guys here what hits, and in what order, but I never asked. I also focused on hanging off more.
So....my guess is that if you have the stock exhaust you maybe hit that and it "high centered" enough for you to lose traction.
Or...maybe you had something drag and instintively chopped the throttle upsetting the bike?
I'm sure you'll get some better feedback. I could sure use it myself. Anybody??????
That being said, I left the feelers on until I could find out from the guys here what hits, and in what order, but I never asked. I also focused on hanging off more.
So....my guess is that if you have the stock exhaust you maybe hit that and it "high centered" enough for you to lose traction.
Or...maybe you had something drag and instintively chopped the throttle upsetting the bike?
I'm sure you'll get some better feedback. I could sure use it myself. Anybody??????
09-03-2007, 08:40 AM
#5
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SuperBike
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Williamsburg, VA
Posts: 2,455
Glad to hear you are mostly alright, always sucks when it happens. I've never been to a trackday on the hawk so not much help in what parts hit first, just by looking I have to guess stock exhaust.
On a good note, I'd take a low side over a high side any day of the week. Plus now you have a cool story to tell.
I also would like to know more about which pants and jacket you were wearing so I can avoid them in the future.
On a good note, I'd take a low side over a high side any day of the week. Plus now you have a cool story to tell.
I also would like to know more about which pants and jacket you were wearing so I can avoid them in the future.
09-03-2007, 02:30 PM
#6
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Squid
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45
Throttle chop
I don't know, every time I inadvisedly chopped the throttle the next step was inevitably a tankslapper as I saved a highside.
Step 1: Bounce chest off tank.
Step 2:Pull over and groan.
Usually happened when I got on it before fully scuffing new tires. But this is all on the street, too.
Glad my wife didn't know about the Hoveround Scooter when I broke my wrist skateboarding (at 32 yrs old). She might have traded my deck (and our savings) for one.
Step 1: Bounce chest off tank.
Step 2:Pull over and groan.
Usually happened when I got on it before fully scuffing new tires. But this is all on the street, too.
Glad my wife didn't know about the Hoveround Scooter when I broke my wrist skateboarding (at 32 yrs old). She might have traded my deck (and our savings) for one.
09-03-2007, 07:55 PM
#8
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Phoenix, formerly Dallas
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#$%@! How fast were you going? The left pipe and frame slider look like they had a long ride.
Also...were your "feelers" removed from the footpegs before, or did they come off during the crash?
Sorry to see it. If you have full coverage on a bike, is it voided if you dump it at the track?
Also...were your "feelers" removed from the footpegs before, or did they come off during the crash?
Sorry to see it. If you have full coverage on a bike, is it voided if you dump it at the track?
09-04-2007, 05:55 AM
#9
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Squid
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 99
Dont know how fast I was going3rd gear and up in the rpm department. I remember looking over the clip on through the corner, then a facefull of tank, (This is when I first felt my foot move at all) then pavement and a immediate burning sensation on my belly. then I rolled, I thought onto my back, but no scuff marks, but there were scuff marks on the butt of the leathers.
A CR said I should take the feelers off. so, I did.
gotta go to work........
A CR said I should take the feelers off. so, I did.
gotta go to work........
09-04-2007, 06:41 AM
#10
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Superstock
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Trussville, Alabama
Posts: 406
I haven't posted in a while and your thread made me think......
Man! You guys who scrape metal parts scare me just thinking about it! I did remove my peg feelers, bur NEVER intended to scrape the pegs.
I can't imagine riding hard enough and being leaned over far enough to drag the pegs. That's just too much lean angle and/or compressed supsension for me!
I gotta' hang off the inside and drag the knee pucks. They are cheap and intended to rub the road.
Glad to hear no major injuries. And glad it happened at the track rather than on the road (if it was going to happen, the track is the best palce).
Hope you can get your SH back together. Looks like the makings of a good track bike now.
Best of luck-
Brian
Man! You guys who scrape metal parts scare me just thinking about it! I did remove my peg feelers, bur NEVER intended to scrape the pegs.
I can't imagine riding hard enough and being leaned over far enough to drag the pegs. That's just too much lean angle and/or compressed supsension for me!
I gotta' hang off the inside and drag the knee pucks. They are cheap and intended to rub the road.
Glad to hear no major injuries. And glad it happened at the track rather than on the road (if it was going to happen, the track is the best palce).
Hope you can get your SH back together. Looks like the makings of a good track bike now.
Best of luck-
Brian
09-04-2007, 07:42 AM
#11
Senior Member
SuperBike
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Posts: 1,315
You're not a dumbass.... just finding the limits is all.
I had some JR gloves that just kind of dryrotted, so I'm not a big fan of their stuff. Your leathers should not have failed to protect you like that, IMO.
09-04-2007, 11:41 AM
#13
Junior Member
Squid
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Finland
Posts: 17
It's interesting that you have Leo highmounts, we have been measuring those with buddies a couple of times that the left side midpipe extends pretty far and therefore thought they would not be a good choice if planning to do a lot of track days. I wonder if that was your "hard part", instead of sidestand. Are there any marks below the sidestand?
Another issue of personal interest, did you have a zipper between the jacket and pants?
Another issue of personal interest, did you have a zipper between the jacket and pants?
09-04-2007, 06:12 PM
#15
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 134
thanks for telling the tale. been looking into rearsets and leathers. what model of jr leathers are those. some of it looks to be a mesh fabric. any thought as to whether rearsets would have been beneficial? hope you feel better soon
09-04-2007, 07:30 PM
#16
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MotoGP
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gainesville FLA.
Posts: 3,844
The kickstand should not be a problem, mine is pointy now from the track so I don't think that's the culprit. I love my rearsets they give the bike a different feel and lots more clearance. More than likely you weren't off the bike enough, the reason you get off the bike is to change the CG,(center of gravity). You want the CG to be low and forward so that the bike doesn't have to lean as far to do the same speed in a corner.
Sorry about the crash, you've got to just get it back together and get back on the horse and let me tell you it will take some time to get the confidence back so try not to stress over it,(but you will). It took me a few months of going over my track wreck in my head before I just said oh well chit happens and TRIED to move on, don't worry it's natural.
Sorry about the crash, you've got to just get it back together and get back on the horse and let me tell you it will take some time to get the confidence back so try not to stress over it,(but you will). It took me a few months of going over my track wreck in my head before I just said oh well chit happens and TRIED to move on, don't worry it's natural.
09-04-2007, 09:17 PM
#17
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Squid
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 99
I’ve been going over what happened, so I can learn from it. The best would have been a photo/video. I obviously wasn’t leaned out enough. The CR behind me said that he "didn’t notice anything unusual" (or something to that effect) I know he would have said something if he saw anything out of the ordinary, and I don’t know how far back he was, so it may have looked good from his position.
So here is what I have:
I know my head was over the clip ons.
I thought my but was far enough off the seat.
A CR said that I should pull the feelers off, as one of the corner workers wanted to black flag me for dragging parts. So I pulled them off. (CR's have more experience that I do, I trust them)
I didn’t feel my foot rise. (as it did when the feelers dragged)
I have a tendency to put my heel up on the "wing" looking part of the rear set and on the chain guard, which puts just the toe on the peg.
The leathers split at the seams. JR 2 piece. The zipper stayed intact. Between the time I bought them and now, I have lost approx 25lbs, which I believe made the pants to loose and thus twisted on my leg, to where the seam just split.
I could feel the neck guard keeping the helmet straight. Best $40 I have spent.
Held gloves rock.
The first pain I felt was my elbow hitting pavement, and then hyper extending up.
Next pain was my stomach, when my arm went up, I remember being twisted and hitting face down. The bruise on my leg indicates that the bike fell on my leg, which was then rolled between the bike and the pavement.
Because of the pain, I rolled onto my back. I thought I rolled on my back, but the only scuff marks were on the seat of the pants, so I had rolled/sat up.
I felt my ankle hurt when I first stood up. Boots have small scuffs on the toes. And half of those were already there.
I didn’t feel any pain on my leg, till after I had got up and off the track.
So I find the following faults:
I should have been leaned out more.
Loose safety gear caused the injuries. (except the bruising)
Neck brace, best $40 I have spent.
So here is what I have:
I know my head was over the clip ons.
I thought my but was far enough off the seat.
A CR said that I should pull the feelers off, as one of the corner workers wanted to black flag me for dragging parts. So I pulled them off. (CR's have more experience that I do, I trust them)
I didn’t feel my foot rise. (as it did when the feelers dragged)
I have a tendency to put my heel up on the "wing" looking part of the rear set and on the chain guard, which puts just the toe on the peg.
The leathers split at the seams. JR 2 piece. The zipper stayed intact. Between the time I bought them and now, I have lost approx 25lbs, which I believe made the pants to loose and thus twisted on my leg, to where the seam just split.
I could feel the neck guard keeping the helmet straight. Best $40 I have spent.
Held gloves rock.
The first pain I felt was my elbow hitting pavement, and then hyper extending up.
Next pain was my stomach, when my arm went up, I remember being twisted and hitting face down. The bruise on my leg indicates that the bike fell on my leg, which was then rolled between the bike and the pavement.
Because of the pain, I rolled onto my back. I thought I rolled on my back, but the only scuff marks were on the seat of the pants, so I had rolled/sat up.
I felt my ankle hurt when I first stood up. Boots have small scuffs on the toes. And half of those were already there.
I didn’t feel any pain on my leg, till after I had got up and off the track.
So I find the following faults:
I should have been leaned out more.
Loose safety gear caused the injuries. (except the bruising)
Neck brace, best $40 I have spent.
Last edited by ride57; 09-04-2007 at 09:19 PM.
09-04-2007, 09:41 PM
#18
Member
Squid
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 55
Loose or not, that suit popped like an anime cherry, there's no excuse for that. The leather doesn't really look like the leather of a racing suit, is it some sort of street/perforated/touring gear? Did it have a full circumference zipper? I've been thinking about the neck protector myself, I'll have to start shopping for one now, for sure.
As for the "hoverround" threat, I like the logic a friend used when he met his present wife, 2nd or 3rd date: "See these bikes? They were here when you got here and they'll be here when you're gone."
You're definitely not a dumbass, though. The track is where you want to be doing this. The best thing is you're going over what happened to learn from it. If you think about it, you're really lucky. Your bike didn't hit a curb, bus, tree, cliff, retirement home, guardrail, church, or child. You didn't have to wait the better part of an hour for the Flashy Bus to get to you and provide the care that you fortunately didn't need since you didn't hit a tree. Hell, a track day is cheaper than a day at the Gap with how they're handing out performance awards.
BTW, this is from my first trackday, and I still ride daily and 3-4 track events a year.
As for the "hoverround" threat, I like the logic a friend used when he met his present wife, 2nd or 3rd date: "See these bikes? They were here when you got here and they'll be here when you're gone."
You're definitely not a dumbass, though. The track is where you want to be doing this. The best thing is you're going over what happened to learn from it. If you think about it, you're really lucky. Your bike didn't hit a curb, bus, tree, cliff, retirement home, guardrail, church, or child. You didn't have to wait the better part of an hour for the Flashy Bus to get to you and provide the care that you fortunately didn't need since you didn't hit a tree. Hell, a track day is cheaper than a day at the Gap with how they're handing out performance awards.
BTW, this is from my first trackday, and I still ride daily and 3-4 track events a year.
Last edited by MotorToad; 09-04-2007 at 09:45 PM. Reason: adding pic
09-05-2007, 11:11 AM
#20
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Phoenix, formerly Dallas
Posts: 141
Whoa
Motortoad....you're not supposed to let your foot slide under the machine steamrolling the fresh pavement on your first trackday. That looks brutal. Wait, is that an arm? Either way...Ouch!
09-05-2007, 07:10 PM
#21
Member
Squid
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 99
I dont know what model these pants are are. They are full circumference zipper. The zipper did not break or come unzipped. There is some sort of solid fabric (mesh is on the inside) in the inside leg area. Same type I have seen in some 1 pc suits.
Someone on another forum suggested rearsets as they will be up higher and will not fold but give more protection in a lowside.
09-05-2007, 08:28 PM
#23
Administrator
World Champion
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Fulton, MO
Posts: 105,287
I'm going to second what Brian A. said. If you're draggin peg feelers then you need to yank them. I dug a feeler into the track at VIR South (by the oak tree) hard enough that the mark is probably still there after 3 years. It almost made me wreck since it took so much weight off the rear. Never had a problem after that. Keep in mind that I have proper suspension setup and that I can get significantly more lean angle now that the springs aren't compressed all to hell. When you get the bike back together, before doing your next track day consider upgrading your suspension.
