Buy American made!!!!!!!!!!!
02-09-2008, 05:34 PM
#1
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Buy American made!!!!!!!!!!!
I ran into this guy at the grocery store that was preaching about why you should buy a Harley. He said he would never buy anything but and that other bikes are pieces of crap. I just laughed it off. We left the store the same time and look at the car he got in................................
02-09-2008, 06:14 PM
#3
OUCH... MY A$$ HURTS!!!
SuperSport
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Elba, Ny
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I have often laughed about the rants regarding American made vehicles...
I off road in a Nissan... And of course, catch slack from the guy's who think that because they own a jeep, they know what they are doing...
Anyway... the AMERICAN Jeep's... are actually assembled in Mexico.. So while there are plenty of CEO's who get rich off of the products, the majority of the jobs involved in producing a jeep are in Mexico, not the US...
However, my Nissan, which is considered an import, and makes plenty of CEO's money outside the US... The production facility is actually here in the US... Which means more US jobs, the our own Jeep's...
Now... as for Suzuki... MOST of the suzuki vehicles sold are not suzuki's, if not all of them... Infact, i am almost certain that the suzuki verona is actually a GM product, and while its a US made vehicle, that particular vehicle is produced in Canada of all places...
I off road in a Nissan... And of course, catch slack from the guy's who think that because they own a jeep, they know what they are doing...
Anyway... the AMERICAN Jeep's... are actually assembled in Mexico.. So while there are plenty of CEO's who get rich off of the products, the majority of the jobs involved in producing a jeep are in Mexico, not the US...
However, my Nissan, which is considered an import, and makes plenty of CEO's money outside the US... The production facility is actually here in the US... Which means more US jobs, the our own Jeep's...
Now... as for Suzuki... MOST of the suzuki vehicles sold are not suzuki's, if not all of them... Infact, i am almost certain that the suzuki verona is actually a GM product, and while its a US made vehicle, that particular vehicle is produced in Canada of all places...
02-09-2008, 07:17 PM
#4
BANNED IN D.C.
SuperSport
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Athens, GA
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speaking of which....i come home today to a friggin 2 thousand dollar Kirby vacuum that my fiancee purchased...at least its made in US...i think.
anyway i told her since she has the ducati of vacuums i want a ducati.
she does not agree.
anyway i told her since she has the ducati of vacuums i want a ducati.
she does not agree.
02-09-2008, 07:20 PM
#5
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SuperBike
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Westerly, RI
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Easy Joshua, there are more reasons for why you get picked on by Jeepers than just it being a foreign vehicle.
As for where Jeeps are assembled, your incorrect. They are still manufactured in Toledo. Have been since 1940. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo_Complex So if you wanna talk about employing Americans, Jeep has been doing so for almost 70 years.
If you wanna know some of the other reasons that Jeepers pick on Nissans, well that's easy. IFS, weak trannys, weak transfer cases, weak rear axle (unless you have the D44). Just not trailworthy. Go ahead, get upset, say to yourself that your Nissan "can go anywhere a Jeep can go". Travel east to RI, come wheel with me. I'll even NOT install the rear locker I have. All stock drivetrain with 4.5" of lift and 35s. I would be impressed if you can keep up. (Had to poke you in the ribs, anyone who gets on the trail to wheel, is a FRIEND of mine.)
Anyway, Buy a Jeep, buy American. I'll be buying some Helimot gloves soon. They are 100% American made.
As for where Jeeps are assembled, your incorrect. They are still manufactured in Toledo. Have been since 1940. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo_Complex So if you wanna talk about employing Americans, Jeep has been doing so for almost 70 years.
If you wanna know some of the other reasons that Jeepers pick on Nissans, well that's easy. IFS, weak trannys, weak transfer cases, weak rear axle (unless you have the D44). Just not trailworthy. Go ahead, get upset, say to yourself that your Nissan "can go anywhere a Jeep can go". Travel east to RI, come wheel with me. I'll even NOT install the rear locker I have. All stock drivetrain with 4.5" of lift and 35s. I would be impressed if you can keep up. (Had to poke you in the ribs, anyone who gets on the trail to wheel, is a FRIEND of mine.)
Anyway, Buy a Jeep, buy American. I'll be buying some Helimot gloves soon. They are 100% American made.
02-09-2008, 08:24 PM
#7
OUCH... MY A$$ HURTS!!!
SuperSport
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Elba, Ny
Posts: 707
Easy Joshua, there are more reasons for why you get picked on by Jeepers than just it being a foreign vehicle.
As for where Jeeps are assembled, your incorrect. They are still manufactured in Toledo. Have been since 1940. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo_Complex So if you wanna talk about employing Americans, Jeep has been doing so for almost 70 years.
If you wanna know some of the other reasons that Jeepers pick on Nissans, well that's easy. IFS, weak trannys, weak transfer cases, weak rear axle (unless you have the D44). Just not trailworthy. Go ahead, get upset, say to yourself that your Nissan "can go anywhere a Jeep can go". Travel east to RI, come wheel with me. I'll even NOT install the rear locker I have. All stock drivetrain with 4.5" of lift and 35s. I would be impressed if you can keep up. (Had to poke you in the ribs, anyone who gets on the trail to wheel, is a FRIEND of mine.)
Anyway, Buy a Jeep, buy American. I'll be buying some Helimot gloves soon. They are 100% American made.
As for where Jeeps are assembled, your incorrect. They are still manufactured in Toledo. Have been since 1940. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo_Complex So if you wanna talk about employing Americans, Jeep has been doing so for almost 70 years.
If you wanna know some of the other reasons that Jeepers pick on Nissans, well that's easy. IFS, weak trannys, weak transfer cases, weak rear axle (unless you have the D44). Just not trailworthy. Go ahead, get upset, say to yourself that your Nissan "can go anywhere a Jeep can go". Travel east to RI, come wheel with me. I'll even NOT install the rear locker I have. All stock drivetrain with 4.5" of lift and 35s. I would be impressed if you can keep up. (Had to poke you in the ribs, anyone who gets on the trail to wheel, is a FRIEND of mine.)
Anyway, Buy a Jeep, buy American. I'll be buying some Helimot gloves soon. They are 100% American made.
Couple points...
1st.. I have a 1st generation (2001) Nissan Frontier, and it had the H233 rear end from the factory with limited slip. I can tell you for sure, the H233 rear end is FAR more reliable than the D44 you speak of. Now, as for the 05+ Frontiers, that have availble lockers on the NISMO package, I have wheeled with plenty, many running 33-35" tires with no issuse to date. However, it is NOT a H233 by any means... Nor does the 05+ model have nearly as much aftermarket support as the 98-04 models do. But they do have more HP, which was nice...
As for IFS... That has always been argueable... Now... If your running a D60, or even a Yota front axle, then I'll give you the respect that they are heavy duty... And even a D44 front end, properly built, works well... However I would much rather run a Yota axle... The downside to my H233, is the only locker option was my ARB air locker.. however i am MUCH happier with a selectable option there. And i can tell you for sure, that running a packed LSD front end, rarely requires you engage a rear locker...
As for tranny and transfer case in my truck.. EVERY truck i've seen convert to Solid front axle is still running factory transfer case and tranny... There is NO weakness there.... Infact, the only somewhat weakness that was associated with this aspect was the 98-00 models which has a two piece driveshaft, and carrier bearings would commonly go...
Now..
Head south to Rausch Creek ORV and run Blacks with me all day, and I'm not saying I will be showing you up, as a short wheel based jeep, properly equipted is nice... But you certainly won't be pulling me out... I'll be there Feb 9-10th if you wanna go..
I do have F-250 D44/D60 combo behind the garage that may just go under the nissan one day... But honestly, I'll take limited, or locked LSD over open solid any day.... And since 95% of the jeeps out there are open/open, i've pulled my fair share out of the trails... You do pay more attention to components when your IFS, however you have less to drag, and as long as your suspension and steering is properly updated, unless your out west on the serious rocks, there really isn't any true advantage other than better flex pictures...
as for my rig... 01 Frontier SuperCharged, Locker H233 rear, LSD front, 3.5"front/5"rear suspension lift, heavy duty steering centerlink, adjusters, and ends, TJM T-17 winch bumper, Shrockworks rock sliders, Skid Row full belly skids, and i'm sure i'm missing something... oh yea... 33's for now...
not the same tires anymore, but thats it on 32's at the time...
NOW...
back to the topic... I was pretty sure they produced most jeeps in Saltillo, Mexico, however after searching, it looks like both of our information is outdated... Many of Cryslers products are produced in Satillo still i believe, and if i'm not mistaken, the wranglers where not assembled in Toledo untill 2001 and newer... again, my facts may not be 100% correct, but they do produce many of the products in Saltillo, Mexico..
either way... any vehicle sold in the US creates US jobs, as I have always felt that automotive and home building business are the two largest contributions to jobs in the US, for cars, you have the makers, builders, paint companies, electronics companies, body repair people, painters, insurance companies, sales people, tire companies... and so on...
same for houses, roofing, lumber yards, carper companies, hard wood flooring companies, insurance companies, realtors, siding companies, exct...
So.. when can i winch your jeep? lol
same here, anybody on the trails is a friend....
02-09-2008, 08:53 PM
#9
KindredGhost
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Wait a second... did you just say your wife purchased a 2,000 dollar vacuum? Wow... I'd be PISSED! Even if it was her money!
KG
02-09-2008, 09:12 PM
#10
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Hey - I had two Harleys and all they did was leak oil, bog, shed parts and make me broke. Best thing I did was go back to Japanese bikes. As far as buying American cars, no thanks. My wife and I literally used to spend thousands a year on two American cars for all sorts of mechanical and electrical crap, transmissions, oil seal leaks, etc. that never should have happened at their mileage. Now she has a Camry and I have a loaded Maxima with 137,000 miles on it. Both won't die and neither have been to a mechanic for years - and the regular maintenance I do is a snap. When my friends and family tell me the same about their American cars, I'll consider buying one.
$2,000 for a vacuum cleaner? You'd better be the one getting serviced........
$2,000 for a vacuum cleaner? You'd better be the one getting serviced........
02-09-2008, 10:07 PM
#11
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Condor, you have 3 business days to call the bastards back and return it. Kirby is sold door-to-door and there are laws in all states which allow this cooling off period. If your wife is dead set on getting one then hit up ebay.
Back in Sept. 2003 my wife did the same thing. I got one off ebay for $655, essentially brand new with all the accessories. It's a great vacuum. A bit heavy going up and down stairs. Cleans edges fairly well and sucks like crazy. Mine has a 5 year warranty. Never had any problem with it in the 4-1/2 years of ownership. You have to pull the roller out and clean the hair out every so often if you have pets. Otherwise it's very easy to live with. I'm even using the original drive belt. Don't get the Kirby shampoo attachments. They suck. You're better off just buying a Bissell shampooer at WalMart.
Remember, 3 business days!!!!
Back in Sept. 2003 my wife did the same thing. I got one off ebay for $655, essentially brand new with all the accessories. It's a great vacuum. A bit heavy going up and down stairs. Cleans edges fairly well and sucks like crazy. Mine has a 5 year warranty. Never had any problem with it in the 4-1/2 years of ownership. You have to pull the roller out and clean the hair out every so often if you have pets. Otherwise it's very easy to live with. I'm even using the original drive belt. Don't get the Kirby shampoo attachments. They suck. You're better off just buying a Bissell shampooer at WalMart.
Remember, 3 business days!!!!
02-09-2008, 10:46 PM
#12
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SuperBike
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: South Lake Tahoe, CA, USA
Posts: 1,689
American car manufacturers are screwed from all the legacy and health care cost from years of being strongarmed by the unions. They were developed for sound reasons, but have way too much power. If the US manufacturers want to get back in the game, then every employee needs to figure out what he/she is willing to give up to aid in the success of their employer. But since everybody has a case of the gimme gimmes, there ain't much hope.
If the government wants to give us a tax break, start taxing imports and give some incentives for producing on home soil. We are giving away the farm, while the CEOs get rich. We should all be very afraid (those of us in the middle class, working for a living anyway).
Not ready to buy an American car. I drive them for rental cars. I like my Toyota, built in California, from mostly Japanese parts.
I highly recommend Lee Iaccoca's new book "Where Have All the Leaders Gone."
Time to rise up and take our country back, before it's too late. If it's not already too late.
BTW, the Suzuki-drivin' redneck is too good! And for the Harley's: BUY A F$^$IN MUFFLER, A##$%LE
If the government wants to give us a tax break, start taxing imports and give some incentives for producing on home soil. We are giving away the farm, while the CEOs get rich. We should all be very afraid (those of us in the middle class, working for a living anyway).
Not ready to buy an American car. I drive them for rental cars. I like my Toyota, built in California, from mostly Japanese parts.
I highly recommend Lee Iaccoca's new book "Where Have All the Leaders Gone."
Time to rise up and take our country back, before it's too late. If it's not already too late.
BTW, the Suzuki-drivin' redneck is too good! And for the Harley's: BUY A F$^$IN MUFFLER, A##$%LE
Last edited by RCVTR; 02-09-2008 at 10:50 PM.
02-10-2008, 03:13 AM
#13
BANNED IN D.C.
SuperSport
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Athens, GA
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Condor, you have 3 business days to call the bastards back and return it. Kirby is sold door-to-door and there are laws in all states which allow this cooling off period. If your wife is dead set on getting one then hit up ebay.
Back in Sept. 2003 my wife did the same thing. I got one off ebay for $655, essentially brand new with all the accessories. It's a great vacuum. A bit heavy going up and down stairs. Cleans edges fairly well and sucks like crazy. Mine has a 5 year warranty. Never had any problem with it in the 4-1/2 years of ownership. You have to pull the roller out and clean the hair out every so often if you have pets. Otherwise it's very easy to live with. I'm even using the original drive belt. Don't get the Kirby shampoo attachments. They suck. You're better off just buying a Bissell shampooer at WalMart.
Remember, 3 business days!!!!
Back in Sept. 2003 my wife did the same thing. I got one off ebay for $655, essentially brand new with all the accessories. It's a great vacuum. A bit heavy going up and down stairs. Cleans edges fairly well and sucks like crazy. Mine has a 5 year warranty. Never had any problem with it in the 4-1/2 years of ownership. You have to pull the roller out and clean the hair out every so often if you have pets. Otherwise it's very easy to live with. I'm even using the original drive belt. Don't get the Kirby shampoo attachments. They suck. You're better off just buying a Bissell shampooer at WalMart.
Remember, 3 business days!!!!
they apparently did a vac trade in or some ****....took my bissel......i dont know how they will arrange that, but she knows im f'n super unhappy about it. she just gave me **** the other day for buying an amber visor for my Arai.....then she turns around and drops 2k on a friggin vacuum. thanks for the tip, as i thought we were stuck with it. im going to go over the fine print tomorrow, and see what i can do. this actually caused the worst fight we have ever had and it got really heated......so im laying in the guest bedroom typing this. ha. if i can, this thing is going back. sorry for the
and the fact that i 
your ****...back to you...
02-10-2008, 05:20 AM
#14
Senior Member
MotoGP
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: NW North Carolina
Posts: 6,110
My wife got a Rainbow a few yrs for around the same price. LOL....
02-10-2008, 06:10 AM
#15
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Skurup, Sweden
Posts: 6,109
they apparently did a vac trade in or some ****....took my bissel......i dont know how they will arrange that, but she knows im f'n super unhappy about it. she just gave me **** the other day for buying an amber visor for my Arai.....then she turns around and drops 2k on a friggin vacuum. thanks for the tip, as i thought we were stuck with it. im going to go over the fine print tomorrow, and see what i can do. this actually caused the worst fight we have ever had and it got really heated......so im laying in the guest bedroom typing this. ha. if i can, this thing is going back. sorry for the and the fact that i your ****...back to you...
and the fact that i your ****...back to you...
02-10-2008, 07:28 AM
#19
The Hypno-Toad
Superstock
Superstock
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 467
Finally it all comes together, arguing off roading on the superhawk forum. I didn't buy a Jeep for the american factor. I bought it because I like it, but either way it is an american icon, and an indespensible tool in this winter wasteland I call home.
I bought a Honda because I like Hondas, living in Milwaukee I simply will not have the Harley argument. I've never seen an argument change someone's mind anyway.
Now I'm looking to buy a BMW 330 to compliment the Jeep, I know...no loyalty to anyone.
By the way, nice Nissan, that's no grocery getter.
I bought a Honda because I like Hondas, living in Milwaukee I simply will not have the Harley argument. I've never seen an argument change someone's mind anyway.
Now I'm looking to buy a BMW 330 to compliment the Jeep, I know...no loyalty to anyone.
By the way, nice Nissan, that's no grocery getter.
02-10-2008, 07:36 AM
#20
OUCH... MY A$$ HURTS!!!
SuperSport
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Elba, Ny
Posts: 707
I wheeled every blue, purple, and several blacks at both of those parks with 32" tires and no locker.
Lift is nice, but not always what i suggest first... If you can pick your lines, you can go pretty far...
Tires are very important, not so much size, but appropriate tread... You need a good tire, and preferable something with a side bite to it.... You will be airing down your tires to 15-20psi or lower depending on the tires which allows the tire to flex over rocks and such, instead of tearing them...
Lift would only be the first suggestion if you NEED the lift to clear tires... There are two types of lifts available, Suspension Lifts, which are typically prefered, because they lift the frame of the vehicle higher, but they do change the suspension, which if you are an occasional wheeler, you may not like the new ride... Body Lifts simply place spacers between the frame and body mounts to lift the body, but the frame/suspension components stay in the exact same place, which means your stock ride will not change any, however you would typically have more room for big tires, as the wheel wells would be higher than stock... Keep in mind, the only TRUE lift is larger tires... But don't be fooled, you don't need HUGE tires... a 31" tire will get you lots of places, and 33-35" tires can handle basically anything except some of the mud bogging pits, which i don't really consider wheeling...
I don't know jeeps well, so you want to get to know your jeeps weak points. For instance, my trucks steering centerlink bushings where a common issue, so i upgraded the centerlink pretty quickly... The other protection to look into is "rock sliders" or "rock rails" which are steal tubes that run along your rocker pannels to protect the body from being pinched. Also, skid plates... Protect your t-case and gas tank with 3/16" or thicker steal plates, and in most cases, your engine oil pan, and tranny too.... I personally have full belly skids from my front bumper to my gas tank... 3/16" steel all the way back...
The most common limiting things on jeeps i've wheeled with is not lift, or not so much tires... but open axles, and lack of armor.... if you wheel, you will have body damage from time to time... so accept that before you go... because most have open axles, only one wheel spins at a time on each axle, and its the one with the lease resistance... which means if a wheel leaves the ground, its more likely to be the one to spin.. a locker will lock the axle so both turn at the same time, all the time when engaged... this is huge for solid axles though, and the reason is the front diff sits lower on solid axle rigs than IFS rigs, and it is commonly pushed through stuff... which is the #1 reason they get hung up... they front axle gets hung up, or is basically plowing mud, and momentum is lost... a locker up front will drag you through most anything....
So... i know i didn't exactly answer your question... but here is a list to start thinking about...
1st of all... gear... if you wheel, you need gear... do you have working tow points front and back? do you have clevis's or shackels for those tow poitns? do you have a toe strap? NOT A CHAIN, preferably a closed loop ended toe strap... Do you have a full sized spare tire? Do you have tools onboard? spare parts that may be commonly replaced? Winch or Come-a-long (manual winch)? Do you have a good working CB Radio? as lots of times you wheel in places with less than perfect cell coverage, and communication of trial condition is important.
2nd. Trail able tires? if you have capable tires already, skip this step... (only make lift important if you need tire clearance for new tires)
3rd. Armor Armor Armor
4th. Lift
then once you have lift/tires/armor/gear, you will be able to tell what your other needs are...
sorry for the book...
02-10-2008, 07:37 AM
#21
OUCH... MY A$$ HURTS!!!
SuperSport
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Elba, Ny
Posts: 707
02-10-2008, 07:45 AM
#22
The Hypno-Toad
Superstock
Superstock
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Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 467
02-10-2008, 11:10 AM
#23
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Location: Cincinnati Ohio
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I saw a great bumper sticker on the back of a FJ Cruiser the other day...
"If I Wanted A Hummer I Would Have Called Your Girlfriend"
Also saw a Dodge truck with a bumper sticker that said...
"After I Hooked Up With Your Jeep It Burns When I Pee"
"If I Wanted A Hummer I Would Have Called Your Girlfriend"
Also saw a Dodge truck with a bumper sticker that said...
"After I Hooked Up With Your Jeep It Burns When I Pee"
Ouch!
02-10-2008, 11:34 AM
#25
The Hypno-Toad
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Superstock
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 467
Hey, my Jeep's only been with two people, and the other one was my mom...oh, crap.
02-10-2008, 03:40 PM
#27
OUCH... MY A$$ HURTS!!!
SuperSport
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Elba, Ny
Posts: 707
I didn't get home until after dark... I'll take a picture of my sticker tomorrow and post it...
Its the white cross, with Jeep Recovery Vehicle printed next to it...
I've also got...
NIORA (northeast import off road association)
UNYX (upstate ny xterra club)
NOAS (nissan off road association of the southeast)
clubfrontier.org (frontier specific forum)
expeditionportal.com (off road forum specific to long trail prep)
take it out and play with it! (a reminder of why i bought a 4x4)
Horny Wheeler (nickname for the truck, after hitting the horn on rocks)
Rausch Creek ORV (off road park in PA)
Paragon Adventure Park (park that was in pa untill they closed)
Shrockworks (product sticker)
K&N (i guess cause i just needed a sticker for the other side)
and i'm sure there are more i'm forgettting.... oh yea, the TJM stickers...
Its the white cross, with Jeep Recovery Vehicle printed next to it...
I've also got...
NIORA (northeast import off road association)
UNYX (upstate ny xterra club)
NOAS (nissan off road association of the southeast)
clubfrontier.org (frontier specific forum)
expeditionportal.com (off road forum specific to long trail prep)
take it out and play with it! (a reminder of why i bought a 4x4)
Horny Wheeler (nickname for the truck, after hitting the horn on rocks)
Rausch Creek ORV (off road park in PA)
Paragon Adventure Park (park that was in pa untill they closed)
Shrockworks (product sticker)
K&N (i guess cause i just needed a sticker for the other side)
and i'm sure there are more i'm forgettting.... oh yea, the TJM stickers...
