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Buddies 98 VTR seized

Old 01-01-2006, 09:11 PM
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Buddies 98 VTR seized

It has 20k miles and it started making some noise and seized up. I haven't seen it yet and he hasn't pulled it apart so I'm not sure whats going on. One thing I would like to know is the VTR uses an interference engine. I'm thinking it'll have a broken cam chain from what he's told me.

If its an intereference engine I'm guessing atleast half the valves are bent and the cam chain wrapped around the crankshaft to seize the motor.

Is this an interference engine?

If it is, does it "usually" do any damage to the pistons or just to the valves when the cam chain breaks?
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Old 01-02-2006, 05:03 PM
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interference engine means if the main chain broke, then the valve would go down and hit the piston on it way up and break the piston and usually bend the valves. In the non interference engine, even if the belt/chain breaks, none if that will happen.
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Old 01-02-2006, 09:15 PM
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bronco78, I hadn't learned that until long after starting wrenching. When you start replacing broken timing belts on jap cars you hear it alot.

We pulled the valve covers today and found a loose chain on the front cylinder caused by a broken cam chain tensioner spring.

I guess I need to pull the head and check for valve/piston damage now.

I hope the front cam chain isn't a bitch to replace.
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Old 01-02-2006, 09:19 PM
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So is it an interference engine or not?
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Old 01-02-2006, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Loco";p=&quot View Post
So is it an interference engine or not?
Good Call!!
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Old 01-03-2006, 08:34 AM
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Before pulling the head I'm going to check the valve clearances. Excessive clearance should tell me if I have any bent valves. I might get lucky with the valves and hopefully if the chain looks good I can just re-time the cams and install a new tensioner and away we go. Although I think that may be an optimistic outcome.
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Old 01-03-2006, 08:42 AM
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Well because the tensioner broke I think my cams stopped moving for atleast a few revolutions and if either the intake or exhaust valves were fully extended at the time the piston would have smacked the them.

Hopefully I got lucky and the feeler gauge yields good news.

Thanks for the help bronco78!
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Old 01-03-2006, 10:39 AM
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I think your right but it the valves are within spec they have to be fine. We're talking about hundredths of a mm. Most likely they'll be damaged and I'll have to pull the head though. After looking at the manual I'm not too worried about changing the cam chain. Looks to be easier than previously speculated.
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Old 01-03-2006, 11:02 AM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

Its very common for the older CCT springs to break around 20-30k. Thats why some of us have gone to the manual aftermarket kind. Honda has also addressed the problem by updating them (a couple of times).

Be warned people who've never changed them.
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Old 01-03-2006, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by NOrrTH";p=&quot View Post
Its very common for the older CCT springs to break around 20-30k. Thats why some of us have gone to the manual aftermarket kind. Honda has also addressed the problem by updating them (a couple of times).

Be warned people who've never changed them.
If I order a set for a 98 VTR will I get the latest set of the same old junk? I think I might just order two 919 units to be sure they are the latest and greatest. This kid knows little about bikes and I don't think he would want to hastle with the manual (ape style) tensioners.

Thanks for the info!
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Old 01-03-2006, 02:06 PM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

I'm sure you would get the lastest ones which I believe have a pink painted dot on them but am not sure.

Maybe someone else on here can speak up. I think its time for a sticky on this issue.
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Old 01-03-2006, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by NOrrTH";p=&quot View Post
I'm sure you would get the lastest ones which I believe have a pink painted dot on them but am not sure.

Maybe someone else on here can speak up. I think its time for a sticky on this issue.
The one we pulled out had a pink painted dot. I think that just means which end is up.
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Old 01-03-2006, 07:18 PM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

You could use a leakdown test to help determine the ability of your valves to seal.
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Old 01-03-2006, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Speed_Demon";p=&quot View Post
Originally Posted by NOrrTH";p=&quot View Post
I'm sure you would get the lastest ones which I believe have a pink painted dot on them but am not sure.

Maybe someone else on here can speak up. I think its time for a sticky on this issue.
The one we pulled out had a pink painted dot. I think that just means which end is up.
It tells which revision it is. It went from no dot, to a white dot, to a pink dot to something else, I think. Anyway, I don't rightly remember. But I don't think the pink dot is the latest revision.
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Old 01-04-2006, 12:44 AM
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The current revision on the Blackbird/X11 is a Blue dot, if that helps. Haven't checked into the VTR ones yet, but I have an engine to rebuild shortly, so I'll be looking into it as well.
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Old 01-04-2006, 02:14 AM
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Welp here it is. Bent exhaust valves on the front cylinder but the piston looks good. I think we have a head lined up but if any of you have a good one for a good price let me know. We also need a cam chain (better safe than sorry, a head gasket, and a set of the updated tensioners.

I'll try to remember to take some pics to show you guys what a bad tensioner or broken cam chain does to valves.

Its pretty impressive how large the pistons are. Bigger than my fist! From now on I'm going to refer to the vtr engine as the double donkey puncher.
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:27 AM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

Looks like latest CCT have orange dot...well - in Europe.
I've been told to buy latest one with partnumber that ends with -013, and that one indeed was latest Honda had and it had orange dot on it.
could be of course that in US that part have pink dot, this is why I loked at partnumber instead of color....
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Old 01-04-2006, 03:21 PM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

All this CCT horror makes me a bit nervous. My 98 has 11,000 miles
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Old 01-04-2006, 05:07 PM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

Mine were still fine at 40,000 km's but I replaced them just in case. Too many horror stories.

Going 250kmh with the engine wound out, I couldn't stand the thought of it seizing under me.
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Old 01-05-2006, 01:31 PM
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Hey all, i am the guy with the bike that is being discussed. I have pix of the broken valves. I will be posting them. Thanks for all the great input.
-Josh
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Old 03-13-2006, 02:22 PM
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Well he finally got all the parts and we put it together last weekend. He said it ran like crap and wouldn't idle before. Now it runs flawlessly. Actually better than mine.
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Old 03-13-2006, 02:27 PM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

Yeah, Thanks much mike. It was fun to ride last night. It finally doesnt idle awefully. ANd it didnt seem to have any cold start issues. I am very happy!
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Old 03-13-2006, 04:10 PM
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Re: Buddies 98 VTR seized

how hard are these tensioners to replace my 99 has 20,000 miles and I am planning on getting the valve clearence checked this spring would this be a good time to replace them I can handle minor repairs but major teardown scares me to death!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 03-13-2006, 08:13 PM
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THey are kinda fussy, but not challenging. Just have to be careful. If you do it wrong, you will have bent valves. It is a good time to do it though. I had 20,100 miles on mine when it went. We changed the tensioners out with ones from a 10k miles engine.
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