mikstr

Take a look: POWER X-WING (V-TWIN)

In looking through their offerings, they make one in 48mm size: POWER X-WING

Thoughts? Comments?

thedeatons

Someone do some before and after dyno testing...

RoadManiac

sounds ok by theory
but their not bolt on for our carbs, and when you realize that you need 2 and its 260 dollar then no thank you

mikstr

I found a set of two on ebay for 180$ (set for Ski-Doo 600 SDI engine, also 48mm)..... it may not be a simple bolt-on, but it could be worth the effort to make it work.... besides, were it not for some thinking outside the box and getting their hands dirty, we wouldn't have stick coils, USD forks, braced swingarms,...

7moore7

Almost seems like you could make one on your own, unless the particular shape of the fin is extremely important or fine tuned. They show a picture of a CV carb on the top of the page, but I wonder if having a plate across the middle of the intake would cause problems with this (as it seems like you may be causing it to draw more air over one side of the X)

On that note, I wonder if you could use the same principal but with only one or two fins running vertically instead of two making an x... speculation here of course. If my idea works I'm calling it the POWER TIE FIGHTER.

CrankenFine

MAY THE FLOATS BE WITH YOU!

Ons'Ro

My experience, with this product, has been with Harleys and yes they do work. I have worked at two shops that had dynos, one being a dealer and they always showed an improvement in power.

thedeatons

Where was the improvement? Top end? midrange? low end?

Was it a hp curve improvement or torque curve?

Do you happen to remember the percentage of increase?

James

Ons'Ro

I saw improvement across rpm range. It was an improvement to both. Remember these were H-D bikes already set up for torque. One bike was all but stock. It was a standard high flow filter and air box, re-jet and exhaust. It saw the greatest improvement. The others were well hopped up and only showed minor improvements. So as far as percentages, I think it all depends on the application. The more stock the engine the greater the percentage.No guarantee of 5% increase on all bikes in any state of tune, but I don't think it would ever hurt power.

smokinjoe73

There was a product just like this years ago. Called the cyclone or something.

It vortexes the air so it travels faster and more efficiently. They would spin a soda bottle to vortex and show how much faster it flowed.

Sound physics it seems, but yeah, it just creates spiral flow. Seems pricey for what it is. At the very least, you could buy it and make your own or mold it. (then sell it cheap to fellow hawkers)

CruxGNZ

One person to talk to would be 8541Hawk. He would be able to tell us if it's good or not to put these buggers in the airbox. I think he might say, with our bikes anyways, that it's not a good idea to put anything inside the airbox.

However, this X-Wing looks VERY easy to make. It would be interesting to use my Veypor gauge and test before and after. Maybe I will get around to it this coming riding season and see what happens

kenmoore

I recently did the air filter retainer and lip mod and felt an improvement.

If these things delivered like that I would be happy.


Who will be the guinea pig?

CruxGNZ

You know, to me, there are quite a few things on thier website that just doesn't sound quite right.

I mean, for instance, is this true?
This just doesn't sound right. To make a denser charge, you would need the air to be either colder than ambient temperature, or compressed, or both...right? I'll have to have a look into it tomorrow, for I am not to sharp at the moment (can't sleep and poured me a few Glenlivet 18... )

NHSH

I guess the molecules become more social and friendly and coddle together before they go and mate with the gas molecules...... yea, I can see that happening... What????

CruxGNZ

So...I got bored today and drew up the templates for one of these fellas. Puttin' the wheel to steel tomorrow. Pictures to follow.

Why? Well, after doing the F.I.L. mod, I was looking at something to straighten out the airflow post filter anyways, and these look like they could fit the bill.

While I'm making the base of this, I can raise the velocity stacks if I wanted to. The question is, should I? And if I did, by how much?

7moore7

I wouldn't... my thinking is that if them being taller was a good thing Honda would have made them so. The billet Dr Honda ones are actually a bit shorter than the "tall" stock stack.

CruxGNZ

No kidding? I always thought the Dr. Honda stacks were taller for some reason. Honestly, that was the only reason I asked the question. Never mind then.

kenmoore

Whatching this with much interest.

I wonder if the X-Wing will live up to its hype.


I was around in the 70's when boost bottles on our 2 Strokes were all the go, so pardon my cynicism!


They did jack you know what, and I have a feeling these may be the same.


Still, you never know.

mikstr

While I can understand your cynicism, this has NOTHING to do, or is in any way similar to boost bottles.... why not compare it to the short-lived Honda ATAC chamber while we're at it? Or maybe the Hondamatic transmission...... see, NO link or connection.........

Rant over......

thedeatons

Taller velocity stacks typically help low end power (if I remember correctly). Shorter velocity stacks help peak horsepower.

I used to dyno test this kind of stuff, but I think I've forgotten more than I remember...

I remember dyno testing Cannondale ATVs and the short velocity stack swap in the airbox added 2hp on the dyno. It was consistent, and a proven peak horsepower gain.


James

mikstr

Bingo (all else being equal, of course)

kenmoore

So what would (will) these help with?

Would it be outright increase in power? torque? fuel economy?


Will they be a benefit across the whole rev range, or only offer a benefit across a limited rev range like when you alter velocity stacks.


I'm confused and curious at the same time.


If they offer benefits that are multiple I could be tempted.


My reference to boost bottles is that there claims in my experience were hollow, and I wonder if the same applies?


Hard data such as Dyno runs under a wide range of conditions would help to make my mind up about these additions.


I have read many posts on many forums about how sensitive our bikes are to intake modifications and taking into account that many people are on these forums with way more knowledge than me, have and are playing with their intake systems right now trying to increase velocity, smooth out air flow pre and post filter and all sorts of other things that I won't even pretend to understand and taking into account that our bikes have been around a long time why haven't I heard about these before.


Please don't misunderstand me, of course I hope they work and improve my bike for the better at minimal cost, however I have over the years witnessed and experienced a lot of products that Automotive and Cycle companies have promoted as ground breaking, only to see them disappear and be replaced by the next big thing.


I'm confused to say the least and am looking forward to someone fitting them to their bike and letting us know what happens, and what changes were made to get a result.


Like I said, watching with interest, and hoping that they work! Not the other way around.

CruxGNZ

So, I did make thise templates a while back. Turns out the velocity stacks are a bit more complicated than one would think. The taper isn't exactly a straight line. I want the edge of my CruX-Wing patent pending to be tight up against the wall of the velocity stack from the top to the bottom.

I finally got some time to redo the templates. Both stacks are completely different. I have decided not to attach the X-Wing underneath the velocity stack. It will be attached TO the velocity stack. More pictures to come.



Showing the taper.


I'm fortunate to have a spare set of carbs and airbox to play with. Makes things a crap load easier. You'll see why I got a good deal on these carbs in a following picture.


Just test fitting them.


Here is a straight on shot. If you look close, you can see the carb slide is breaking apart. That's why I got 'em cheap. Got nice used slide lined up from a local member. Anyways, here's the picture.

TAMPAHAWK68

All those things do is atomize the fuel for more efficient combustion, roughing up your intake ports a little will accomplish the same thing.

CruxGNZ

Here is the way I was thinking about attaching it. There will be a tab on both sides. After holding it in my hand, it works, but just doesn't look nice. If I'm going this far, may as well make it look nice as well. I'll make it so the tab flows well. More of an "S" shape starting from the top of the X-Wing.

The X-Wing is for the most part friction fit into the velocity stacks. The bottom of the X-Wing is 1/16" above the carb slide. If something was to fail with this design, it cannot be sucked into the engine. If a part of the X-Wing was to be sucked into the engine, then you crashed and have other things to worry about haha

CruxGNZ

Micky, I just noticed that you have billet aluminum velocity stacks. How were you thinking of fitting yours if you were to pick up a set from Boyesen? Looking at the Dr. Honda stacks, I have a couple ideas if you're interested.

kenmoore

I hope this works.


I am very interested in this.


I have had some head work done, but the ports on the head were pretty good.


In the old 2 stroke days we used to try and enlarge and smooth the ports.


Seams that on the inlet side of a 4 stroke that this is not ideal.


Maybe these things will help to increase the charge by speeding things up a bit.


Is that what they are all about?


Would love to see some Dyno of before and after.


As we say here in Oz" Good on ya for having a go"


Maybe you are like me and have run out of things to do to your bike, and how good would it be if these things actually work.

mikstr

project is dormant for now (have other things on the go at the moment)...... feel free to share your ideas, however

Jack Flash

+1. This is old school technology to me. In my 2 stroke world, we used things like this in the late 90's early 2000. Evolotion has brought us to drop these wing type designs in the intakes.

However, not to be just a sour puss, I've heard of truckers using wing type deffuser in their diesel powered rigs and getting better gas milage out of them.

There's a thought. Convert the Hawk into a diesel, and, get better gas milage out of those puny gas tanks we have... I smell OCMD

smokinjoe73

I think this is the product I remember back in the day for the same purpose. I think the x wing just didnt want to copy it directly.

Vortec Cyclone - Save Gas, Boost Horsepower

And this
and this other one
Cyclone X again
The tech seem sound, its just that auto airboxes have more room to install it (it seems). I hope it works since I always wanted one back then, but had a cbr (4 needed).

Now maybe I can do it with only 2 intakes