EngineNoO9

k. this summer and fall I want to do several track days to get into it (I already really want to) and figure I'll do those on the superchicken to make sure I like it and all. Then winter buy an r6 track bike (yes a dreaded 600cc inline 4 ) and use that instead because well I'll care a lot less if I thrashed that then my superhawk... So what's the opinions on here about this? specifically from marmalade who I know does a bit of track riding...






*plus I figure I might as well try and get my toys now before I get into a relationship :P *

redsuperhawk

If you dread the I4 so much, look at the SV650. That is one heck of a track bike, tons of aftermarket parts, meatier lowdown torque than the R6 although not as much top end, probably cheaper to buy, and it's a V-twin!

I wish I could say I knew this from experience, but it's just word of mouth, reading on other forums, etc.

Jeff
redsuperhawk

superhawk22

I try to do 2 trackdays every 3-4 months and I'd say the R6 is one of the most popular bikes out there. Because of that there are alot of parts available for it so that brings prices down. It handles great and has good track power one of the fastest guys on the track I go to rides the hell out of one. The gsxr600 is probably just as popular and is a very capable bike as well and parts are usually a little cheaper.

All that said I'm planning on getting a track bike in a few months and I'm leaning towards the gsxr750. I don't really want to race, (yes I do but have other obligations), since I'm not worried about what class it's in I want the extra torque and HP of the 750. It handles better than the 1000 but easier to ride than the 600 because you shift less.

My .02

Oh the sv is popular to but I've ridden one and well....I just want something that I won't have to keep shifting all the time.

marmaladedad

I'm sure I haven't done as many trackdays as some of the other members here, but I'll throw in my 2cents worth.

The R6 does make a great trackbike, as can be attested to when you look around the pits at a trackday. I found, however, that the bike really is twitchy. While the Superhawk requires a real push to turn, the R6 falls into the turn really easily. It requires a real retuning of your senses from the SH.

Another alternative is the GSXR600/750. I found that my 750 pulled a bit harder than the SH (especially in the higher rpms...i4's!), and turned in much more easily than the SH. GSXR600/750 have tons of aftermarket support. Not only that, but since there are lots of them out there, you can find parts easily (some 600 and 750 parts can be swapped).

Having a track-only bike is a great idea if your pocket book can handle it. I thought mine could with the GSXR, but it made more financial sense for me to have only one bike (saving up for a house).

The more work you do to your SH, the more likely you won't take it to the track. All the hard work put into fixing it up is heart-breaking if you have to see your bike's wings clipped. However, they make good track bikes with some suspension work. I have no trouble giving other twins fits in turns and straights (just have to get a better drive out of turns). 1000 i4's are harder work, but it's satisfying to know you can take something "not fast" and make it go-go-go.

My recommendation is to find an inexpensive bike that hasn't been only a race/track bike. The ones you find that have previously been trackbikes have led really hard lives.

EngineNoO9

oh I don't dread the i4. I like the twin better but for racing it'd be better and well I'd like to be able to be comfortable on each type for the day that I decide to get another street bike... The r6 or some other variant of a 600 super sport is what I'll prob go for and I'm told that getting used to the i4 is gonna be the hardest part coming from the 1000 v-twin... And yes I want something street legal so that it wasn't always a track bike that's had a hard life... That and I can get comfortable with it on the street before riding the **** out of it on the track... (suggestion from another racer I know that said since I've never ridden a 600ss that it'll be tough jumping on one for the first time at a track)

superbling

What about another VTR? Besides having a spare parts bike at the ready for either street or track emergencies, you'd be real familiar with wrenching on it and riding it.
Plus their cheeeeeep.

EngineNoO9

that is possible... i dunno. half the reason I wanted to was I wanna ride a 600 i4 cause I haven't yet and they seem like fun other then the noise they put out :P I'll research into it when the time comes... we're a lil far away from when I'd be looking to actually get one..

willie

EngineNoO9,
where in virginia are you located? what originization are you looking to run with? I guess you would hit vir or summit point? Like everyone has said there are a ton of r6's & gsxr's out there which makes parts readily available. An sv wouldn't be a bad choice either, they are pretty popular in a couple of race classes in wera.

willie

EngineNoO9

I'm in Blacksburg but graduate in like 3 weeks so not sure where I'm going... It'll all be east coast stuff from like georgia to pa... I kinda don't like the vtr race bike idea just cause that's one reason I want the 600 super sport cause they come much better off stock in terms of readiness and ability at the track. That and a lil bit of change would be nice so I don't always have the same feel... I don't really want an sv cause I'm gonna feel such a huge difference in power and it'll feel slow. Yeah the 600's are all top end but at least up top it'll be similar to the vtr's power if not better since they pull so hard up top...

Loco

I guess I will not ever understand why one would want a bike one isn't familiar with for a trackday. I personally love riding the SH out at the track. Track days are not for finishing first place or grabbing the hole shot, and very few of us are at the expert racing level. I see a few drawbacks of having the superhawk as your track bike, but why would you want to switch over to a whole different style of riding, with entirely different bike mechanics and nuances? The part I love the most is knowing what my bike will do in just about any situation, including at the track. I ride the same bike out at the track that I do on the street, the only thing I would change might be some racing compounds.

superhawk22

Don't get me wrong, I absolutley LOVE riding the Superhawk on the track and agree about knowing the machine and it being all about the fun and not the results. But parts aren't as cheap and although all the mods I've done have been track oriented mods, I'd love to be able to pass in the straights as well as the corners. I can out brake a lot of guys but It still pisses me off when I make a beautiful pass and then the same squid who slowed me down in the twisties grabs a handful and blows by me. I have put a lot of work into Frankenhawk but the sole purpose of that work was for the track. So yes it would be a sad day to see it shatter into tiny pieces,(hopefully that never happens), but if it wasn't for the track I never would've done it anyway. It's a very street worthy bike the way it was it just wasn't as easy to ride on the track as it is now.

Riding style is another reason I was leaning more towards a 750. The 750 would be more like the Superhawk than a 600 and still weigh less so you get the best of both worlds. If things don't go as planed though the superhawk will see more track oriented mods and the trackbike will go on the back burner. I've also thought about just rididng on the track but it's a very expensive hobby and I'd miss the threapy of just going for a ride.

Loco

yeah I don't buy that crap some people say about riding just on the track and not ever on the street. I feel like you would be such a shitty rider if that was true.

I can appreciate not wanting to wreck your baby, or wanting to pass in the straights, but then can't you see yourself sitting on your R6 in pit lane, going, "**** I wish I didn't have to focus so much on revvs going into that corner, where's the roll-on power?" It's all a trade, and you gotta know the SH isn't the perfect track bike, but it's still a beast.

JamieDaugherty

I've done a lot of track time. Most of it has been on a CBR600, but some on my VTR. When I raced 600cc Production it really opened my eyes to what an I4 can do. They are amazing track bikes and will run circles around a VTR. However, I hate them on the street, that's why I ride a big twin.

You'll find that an I4 is much easier to go fast on. I'd go with a Honda just because they have a better engine. Keeping the revs up is something you'll have to get used to, but it's not that big of a deal. I like the way an I4 will rev forever when you are exiting a corner. The 4's and the twins are two different beasts for sure!

Jamie Daugherty
http://members.iquest.net/~daugherj

superbling

Some of you may know this but the first 98 VTR's came out in early 97, nearly at the end of 96. Work your way back during the design and build phases and the bike is probably late 94/early 95 design technology. This equates it more to the cbrF3 model as an apples to apples comparo'. Agree?

Given that, I think the VTR has a slight edge on the track against an F3 but anything more modern and only a more modern twin (RC51 anyone?) is needed.

marmaladedad

I don't see how not riding on the street and riding on the track-only makes you a shitty rider. Before doing trackdays, I would go *****-out in the canyons. After doing a few trackdays, I realized that I could:

a) go faster at the track than on the street (and legally, to boot!)
b) not worry about oncoming traffic
c) practice my technique when the same turn comes up again in about 2 minutes

After the realization, my speeds on the street dropped a lot. There wasn't a need to push it, since I could get my fix at the track. There are liberties you can take on a track that would get you arrested or killed on the street. Of course, riding on the street (in the canyons) still brings pleasure, but it's a different kind. The skills you practice on the track can transfer over to your street-riding.

As for riding two different styles of motorcycles, it's really not that hard to switch back and forth. Your first few minutes or laps may require a small bit of re-acclimation (depending on how long it's been since you last rode it), but your muscle memory will pick it right back up.

EngineNoO9

yeah for reasons that marmalade said I want to do more track. the i4 lends itself better to it and it doesn't matter what bike I get but I really don't think it's gonna be too hard to switch... I had a i4 550 for 4 months before selling it. I rode the **** out of that. Had nothing down low so I know how to keep revs up...

superhawk22

The main thing you'll have to get used to is corner exits, they're a lot easier and you can get on it a lot sooner with the v twin.

EngineNoO9

yeah I believe that's gonna be the toughest but I learn quickly :P

JamieDaugherty

Actually I find that I can pick up the throttle sooner on the twin than an inline. The rear grip is better on a twin, so you can put more power down eariler. The inlines must be ridden like "point and shoot". If you pick up the throttle too soon on an I4 it will hit the power abruptly and could cause a highside. That tends to put a damper on your day!

Jamie Daugherty
http://members.iquest.net/~daugherj

AKohler996

I agree, if you can not control yourself enough not to "race" on the street, everytime you go out ... then you belong ONLY on the track.
But if you are a true motorcyclist, that only wants to sharpen your skills by doing some track time, that's great. (when I say "you", I am just talking in general, about anyone)
I like the adrenaline rush of track riding, but I think it is much more "stressfull" than riding on the street. On the street I do not have to worry about someone stuffing me in the corner at high speeds.
I can not IMAGINE not "wanting" to ride on the street, and ONLY riding on the track.
Granted you have to have eyes in the back of your head these days, but it is still definitely worth it. I can get killed in my car, on a bicycle, or walking ... I do not think about stopping doing those things.

I bet the SH is awesome on the track though.... maybe I will get some frame sliders and try it. Compared to some of the other bikes I have had on the track, the SH is probably the BEST suited (1997 Buell S3, 1999 Kawasaki ZRX1100, 1986 Honda VFR700 w/ bias ply tires)

Alan

superhawk22

Hey Alan, I think you misunderstood me, it's not that I don't WANT to ride on the street, I do. Actually I find lately that I have the oppisite feelings about the stress levels. Where I live it's getting more crowded every day and the people drive like ********. So I find myself getting very stressed during regular commuting hours and usually stick to night rides for relaxing. While at the track I don't have to worry about the 96 year old lady who can't see over the steering wheel doing 25 in a 55. Or the stressed out bitch on the cell in one hand and the eye liner in the other screeming at her kids to shup up while she's doing 80 in a 50 and wants me to get out of the way because I'm only doing 70. Or the business man who can't wait until he gets to his office to read the wall street journal. On the track I worry about me and the guy in front of me, if someone wants to be an *** and stuff me in a corner so be it. Either he F'd up or he's just another squid but for the most part the track I ride the people are pretty curtious. I really enjoy being able to ride to my limits without worrying about the street hassles and I keep my racing to the track.

Jamie, That's exactly what I was saying, that's about the only real advantage I have when I go to the track. My buddy I go with rides a gsxr1000 so it's all I can do to keep up. Although skill levels keep us about even.

superhawk22

Hey Alan, My brother owns a '96 Buell, I think it's a ST3 thuderbolt but he's done some mods to it so it doesn't really look like one anymore.

EngineNoO9

you know the more I think about this... The more I think I'm just gonna prep this superchicken to do track duty... There's a reason I bought this bike and a reason I love it so much. Not being able to push it hard will just kill me so having it as a street only would be the end of me... Now like someone else mentioned a track vtr on the side is definetely possible... Find one that was maybe totalled or something for cheap and build that up and slap on race plastics

marmaladedad

Joe, that's also a great idea. Finding the limits of your own motorcycle is a great pleasure. I'm not trying to say that I've exceeding the limits of the Superhawk, but it's a lot more hard work keeping up with my friends who have the advantage of lighter weight (not just the bike, but also the rider) or higher horsepower.

It's gratifying when you can pass them with a Superhawk, but after awhile the novelty wears off and you want to see how far you can push yourself on a bike with less limitations.

EngineNoO9

well yeah... I'm still pondering whether or not I'll use this bike and just swap plastics or try and do another... probably cheaper by far to just swap plastics... for us it really isn't hard either. Just hope I don't wreck it. Granted there's always that chance on the street so I need to quit worrying about it. Race plastics would be nice though cause if I do go down at least it's race plastics that get screwed up instead of my the street ones which cost an arm and a leg plus 1 of your kidney's and 1st born...

THEN... when I'm able to actually out ride this bike and am at the point where it holds me back... Then consider a track bike...

marmaladedad

The good thing about swapping plastics every trackday is that you are checking over your bike. Not to say you wouldn't with a dedicated trackbike, but you tend to take it for granted that "the bike is good-to-go."

EngineNoO9

yeah. I'm really leaning toward that I think... Cheaper by far too since I keep forgetting I'm gonna have to get a vehicle to get me to the track along with my bike, need a new helmet and full leathers too. all quite a bit of $$$

marmaladedad

New helmet? What's wrong with the one you've got now?

Full leathers is definitely a good idea. I've fallen thrice now in my suit, and it's held up well (except the one bad crash...but that was easily repaired).

What kind of gear do you have now?

EngineNoO9

new helmet is just something I want. not really needed. current gear:

icon motorhead jacket (selling cause I've lost some weight and it's too big, plus I want something that has a zipper for pants if I want to)
kbc tk-8 helmet (too many shields for it)
joe rocket gloves (forget the name but good street guantlets)
sidi b2 race boots

what I want to get is an agvsport 1 piece suit (several guys I ride with have them and 1 even went down in his and it held up great) and an arai helmet

marmaladedad

Awesome. Looks like you'll be well on your way to track-day fun. It gets real addicting.