TLS vs. VTR
Senior Member
SuperSport
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 524
Depends on who is twisting the throttle.
Which also defines whether a bike is to be considered a "sport bike".
I used to routinely get my but kicked by a guy riding a Kawasaki CSR 305, with me on my RD400, set up for racing no less. He was fun to watch though.....
Kai Ju
Which also defines whether a bike is to be considered a "sport bike".
I used to routinely get my but kicked by a guy riding a Kawasaki CSR 305, with me on my RD400, set up for racing no less. He was fun to watch though.....
Kai Ju
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
With all due respect, the TL1000R is quite possibly the ugliest sportbike ever built. While that has no effect on its qualities as a sporting motorcycle, it would be enough for me to stay away from it (and I do NOT consider myself a poser by any means)
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 388
From: Muskego,WI
I have riden both. TL-S overall a good bike, but as circuit says, there are some frame cracking issues (espically with the rotary shock).
Overall though both are good bikes, but I am biased towards the Superhawk.
Overall though both are good bikes, but I am biased towards the Superhawk.
Senior Member
SuperBike
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,216
From: Westerly, RI
The over 100 pounds difference is the decision maker for me. The TL is a heavier bike. Watch the video with the TL, VTR and Ducati. Shakey Byrnes was having problems with the TL cornering, and the stated cause of the Hawk going down was it was the end of the day and they were still pushing, yes, the short ground clearance helped, but they admitted to pushing the bike.
The 210 rear tire would be another decision maker. Another reason the TL doesn't corner as well.
The 210 rear tire would be another decision maker. Another reason the TL doesn't corner as well.
evil man of nothing
MotoGP
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,516
From: Boynton Beach, FL
The over 100 pounds difference is the decision maker for me. The TL is a heavier bike. Watch the video with the TL, VTR and Ducati. Shakey Byrnes was having problems with the TL cornering, and the stated cause of the Hawk going down was it was the end of the day and they were still pushing, yes, the short ground clearance helped, but they admitted to pushing the bike.
The 210 rear tire would be another decision maker. Another reason the TL doesn't corner as well.
The 210 rear tire would be another decision maker. Another reason the TL doesn't corner as well.
Anyway like Kai says it depends on who's riding. Given equally talented riders and stock bikes a TLS is going to go around a racetrack a little quicker and accelerate a bit quicker too, especially the original model year TL. For a less experienced rider I'd say a superhawk is easier and more comfortable to go fast on. As far as which bike you'd rather own and ride everyday, and which one looks better you may prefer the superhawk.
Last edited by captainchaos; Jun 15, 2009 at 09:12 AM.
ole dirty bastard
SuperSport
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 976
From: my house
Senior Member
SuperBike
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,806
From: Atlanta, GA
The TL1000S was slightly lighter (3 or 4 lbs.) than the Super Hawk. The TLR was about 30 pounds heavier. Both had more motor than the Hawk.
The TL-S had that quirky rotary shock that nobody liked and developed a reputation in the motorcycle press (mostly in Europe) as a dangerous head shaker, which effectively killed the model. Really a pretty good motorcycle, although the looks haven't held up over time as well as the Hawk's.
The TLR was the sportier version of the TLs; it was to the TLS as the RC51 is to the Hawk. Also a pretty good bike, but nowhere near as good as the RC51 and the looks were always controversial. It also had the rotary shock and suffered unjustly from the headshaking reputation of the TL-S.
The TL-S had that quirky rotary shock that nobody liked and developed a reputation in the motorcycle press (mostly in Europe) as a dangerous head shaker, which effectively killed the model. Really a pretty good motorcycle, although the looks haven't held up over time as well as the Hawk's.
The TLR was the sportier version of the TLs; it was to the TLS as the RC51 is to the Hawk. Also a pretty good bike, but nowhere near as good as the RC51 and the looks were always controversial. It also had the rotary shock and suffered unjustly from the headshaking reputation of the TL-S.
Remember stock is BAD!
SuperSport
SuperSport
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 760
From: Jacksonville FL
The motor on the TL's make 20-30 more horse's than the superhawks and there is also a difference in the fueling EFI vs Carbs.
Senior Member
SuperBike
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,806
From: Atlanta, GA
People didn't like the shock for a reason; it didn't work well and was more of a case of being different just to be different instead of being different to be better. Racers replaced the rotary shock with a conventional shock and went about their business.
The TL-S had about 10 more horsies than the Hawk and the TL-R about 15-20 more. Both TLs had EFI and upside down forks.
I think they were good bikes, but neither sold particularly well and Suzuki abandoned them pretty quickly.
The TL-S had about 10 more horsies than the Hawk and the TL-R about 15-20 more. Both TLs had EFI and upside down forks.
I think they were good bikes, but neither sold particularly well and Suzuki abandoned them pretty quickly.
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,547
From: Way Out West
Motorcyclist Magazine tested both in '97;
VTR dyno was 104 hp
TL-S was 112
When they dyno tested the TL-R in '98 it had 121 hp
They tested both VTR and TL-S again in 2000;
VTR- 100.7
TL-S had 106.1
VTR dyno was 104 hp
TL-S was 112
When they dyno tested the TL-R in '98 it had 121 hp
They tested both VTR and TL-S again in 2000;
VTR- 100.7
TL-S had 106.1
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 401
Don't forget among those frame-cracks, that the TL has had numerous electrical problems.
The TL-S is much like the Hawk, a wheelie-machine. Seems like my Hawk was pretty even with the TL. Both had a ton of torque, it felt like the TL had more top end but I guess it didn't, they stay pretty neck & neck.
There's a kid here in town with a TL-R, and I consider that to be the RC-51's rival, not my Hawk's. But of course, I can't help but race the kid whenever I see him...oddly enough, he seemingly isn't able to pass the SuperHawk. My Hawk is pretty much stock other than bolt ons and slips, maybe he's just a shitty rider
The TL-S is much like the Hawk, a wheelie-machine. Seems like my Hawk was pretty even with the TL. Both had a ton of torque, it felt like the TL had more top end but I guess it didn't, they stay pretty neck & neck.
There's a kid here in town with a TL-R, and I consider that to be the RC-51's rival, not my Hawk's. But of course, I can't help but race the kid whenever I see him...oddly enough, he seemingly isn't able to pass the SuperHawk. My Hawk is pretty much stock other than bolt ons and slips, maybe he's just a shitty rider
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 286
From: texas
there is a yellow tlr at my work and that thing looks awsome to me? reminds me of some sort of space ship? as far as beating the hawk i wouldnt bet on it unless we are going straight. the bike just looks heavy and hard to turn. i would be torn if he wanted to trade but i would probally keep the hawk.
Senior Member
SuperSport
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 714
From: Fredericksburg, VA
TLR's have 180 rears.
Best sportbike is a very broad question. When in doubt I go with the Honda reputation for quality machines. Sure the TLS has inverted forks and EFI, but that's one of the nice things about the 'Hawk, fun to mod. And its still a Honda. I had a TLR, we didn't get along so well. Got a 'Hawk right after the TLR and we forged an excellent relationship, I have learned everything I know about proper riding (and wheelying) on the 'Hawk and she has never let me down.
Best sportbike is a very broad question. When in doubt I go with the Honda reputation for quality machines. Sure the TLS has inverted forks and EFI, but that's one of the nice things about the 'Hawk, fun to mod. And its still a Honda. I had a TLR, we didn't get along so well. Got a 'Hawk right after the TLR and we forged an excellent relationship, I have learned everything I know about proper riding (and wheelying) on the 'Hawk and she has never let me down.
Senior Member
Back Marker
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 210
From: Toronto
I have owned both.
I owned 2 TLS's and loved every second on it.
When my last TLS got taken out by a stupid cager, I wanted another one.
But the VTR was the only resonably priced V-twin sport bike being produced.
I bought the VTR and love it.
However, I still miss that crazy TL motor.
Damn that bike was fast. Didn't turn very good, but I loved speed back then.
TL has fuel injection, inverted forks, I didn't mind the rotory damper rear suspension.
I loved that bike and would buy another brand new one if I could find one.
I owned 2 TLS's and loved every second on it.
When my last TLS got taken out by a stupid cager, I wanted another one.
But the VTR was the only resonably priced V-twin sport bike being produced.
I bought the VTR and love it.
However, I still miss that crazy TL motor.
Damn that bike was fast. Didn't turn very good, but I loved speed back then.
TL has fuel injection, inverted forks, I didn't mind the rotory damper rear suspension.
I loved that bike and would buy another brand new one if I could find one.
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
In terms of the SV, there were two generations. If I remember correctly, the 2005 and later versions had larger valves, higher compression ratio (basically bringing back to, or close to, TL-S spec)
Senior Member
Back Marker
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 210
From: Toronto
I was lucky enough to test ride both the SV1000 and the VTR back to back.
I hated the looks of the SV, but thought I would like it because I loved the TLS so damn much.
But when put back to back, The VTR out handled it by leaps and bounds.
Spot on Carbs and it felt lighter.
190 rear tire was stock on all TL's.
I hated the looks of the SV, but thought I would like it because I loved the TLS so damn much.
But when put back to back, The VTR out handled it by leaps and bounds.
Spot on Carbs and it felt lighter.
190 rear tire was stock on all TL's.
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