got another one - brakes just feel weird...
 

ok is this normal at all? gixxer1000 6-pot brakes with ebc pads and 5/8 MC. well today I get one after it being on stands for a week and the lever felt mushy... well even after 5 min of riding it was solid again and solid every time... I guess just check the fluid?? try rebleeding a lil???


never thought I'd say it but I kind've wanna sell for something newer that I don't have to dump so much money into. something that just works smoothly from the get go. :-\

Stupid question from me, but did you pump the lever after reinstalling and bleeding the brake pads/fluid? It usually takes a few pumps of the lever...

yeah. they had been solid for awhile too after seemingly getting them working nicely...

I'm obviously just frustrated and that's why I'm just like fuck it lets sell and move on. I know once I have it running smoothly along with the brakes I'll be happy but seems like nothing but crap the last few weeks.


while were talking about it's issues I'm still having issues with the rear cylinder backfiring - like a puff of air/gas shooting up out of the intake... trust me I've cleaned the sliders too. Another thing that's baffled me. I'm sure probably a pro could figure something out but alas.... not enough $$$$

All the crap you're going through now just makes the bike that much sweeter once she's running well.

I sure hope so...

mine farts through the carbs from time to time are you sure thats not whats happening to you?If you decide to sell the 1000 calipers I'll buy them

Did you sync the carbs and adjust mixture screws to 2 - 2.5 turns out? That will probably cure your backfire through the carb.

Also, are the pads fully bedded in? You know the EBCs work best when they have a little heat in them as well. Give them some time. They will probably come around once bedded in. If not, clean your calipers. One caliper at a time, remove pads, squeeze brake lever to push pistons out some. Clean with lots of brake cleaner and a soft toothbrush. Push pistons back in. Install pads on the same sides they came out. Install caliper. Repeat other side.

i don't think with the 6-pots you can clean them like that.... I think... I'll have to check. im thinking they might be a lil dirty. I don't have too many miles on them either. did 100 hard hard hard miles today... so hopefully that'll help. main thing is the lever feel just is inconsistent at times... doesn't feel like the other bikes in the group (honda 1000rr, 600rr, brand new gixxer 600) i did 2.5 turns. I'm thinking im just way rich now and will have to do a filter to get it smoothed back out

What's with all the brake problems lately? Be patient do everything Hawkrider said and it won't hurt to make sure ther's no air in the system. Check a few of the other brake posts for different bleeding methods.

You can do it just be carefull not to blow the piston all the way out.

they stop and slow me down but they just don't feel "right" really hard to explain feels like they're dragging way more then they should and it's inconsistent with the lever feel

Are they the racing pads? If so they really don't work right unless they are hot. If not it does sound like it may just need to be bedded to the rotors. If it was air it will usually be consistent one way or the other.

AHA! I think I know what it might be. The way you explained it the second time clued me in. I've had this happen on other bikes I worked on. This is going to sound wierd, but try this - it'll only take 5 minutes: Remove the brake lever and thoroughly clean and lubricate it with white lithium grease. Go ride.

ill try that this week.

Sticking? Hmm I supose that could be possible. Has this happened a lot?

You never know the history of the lever. If it was wrecked and got dirt in it or if it sat outside for a long time and was never lubed then....who knows. All depends on preventive maintenance.

I had a CBR600F4 I worked on that dragged the brakes because the lever wouldn't return all the way. Reason: Dirty old grease at the lever pivot. The feel on that lever was so bad I couldn't understand how the owner hadn't wrecked yet.

Hell, I had one dude on a 02 GSXR600 complain of a sticking lever and strange lever feel at the track. The lever didn't want to return. Turns out the Einstein used DOT5 fluid which swelled all his seals. The spring in the master cylinder didn't have enough power to overcome the additional drag from that. The original seals were designed for DOT 3/4 on only that. No recovering from that except to go through the whole brake system and replace ALL the seals.

Makes sense, I guess I just take better care of my brakes then some.

what can be used to clean out dot 5 from lines? Im one of the bright guys that switched without realizing it wasn't a good idea... my friend runs dot 5 on his gixxer1000 brakes though - that could possible be my problem... :( probably have to get new lines for the clutch and rear brake and my fronts should be able to be cleaned since they're SS

Aha!! You're still using those lines? If they're contaminated I don't think I would use them. Don't you have some others already? Swap them out.

i have SS lines for the front. it shouldn't swell those but it's definetely possible that it messed up my front MC. I made the mistake of switching awhile back and was told going back to dot 4 was even worse... could it require me buying new SS lines for all 3 (clutch, front and rear) and getting a rebuild kit for all 3 and cleaning them all thorougly to get the silicone residue off? Cause metal parts can be cleaned of it but any cleaner against rubber is the devil basically from what I remember. That mean I possibly need a rebuild kit for the front calipers as well?

Swelling could happen on the inside like a cheesburger to your arteries the inside is still rubber. Did you do it to all of the lines? I thought you put a different master on it from the swap?

yeah but I still had the same lines. didn't think there was any way to clean them out...? well ok back to square 1... way to fix it is to have to buy rebuild kit for MCs, new lines, and possibly calipers too?

Check the other things first but it is possible.

well I don't like the dot 5 anyways... dot 4 was cheaper too... I know the rear and clutch say dot 4 only but I was a tard and changed it anyways... :-\ fronts there's no indication...

DUH!! Good luck man.

well clutch and rear seems to still be ok. fronts are the ones giving me issues... I'm hoping hawkrider will chime in and give me some insight as to what I can do...

The only thing I could think of would be flushing everything out and maybe use some rubber safe brake cleaner. Nothing that will leave a residue though.

hmm... this might suck quite a bit but I don't really have a choice do I? I really want to switch back... the dot 5 has ruined my mity vac too.... so something is gonna have to be done. rebuild kits can't be that bad can they?? gotta find out which my MC really is... not sure what it is...

Okay, I gather that you have switched to DOT5 and would like to go back to DOT3/4. If it hasn't been in there too long then the seals might not have swelled too much and minimal damage will have been done. The right answer is that you need to do is flush the entire system with denatured alcohol. Personally, I would just buy 2 big cans of brake cleaner and take the whole system apart. There's a chance that if you didn't flush all the DOT3 out when you switched to DOT5, then the two have coagulated and this is causing your wierd braking. I'd still make sure the lever pivot is fresh as well.

If you want to switch out all the seals it's up to you, but I think you may be okay if you switch back to DOT3/4 soon.

dot 4 should've been in before I'd think and is what I wanna switch back to all around (I used dot 4 in all my lines, reason I say I think is the front brakes are new to me). in the fronts it hasn't been too long... 2-3 weeks tops? the clutch and rear brake longer (couple months now...) and those have the rubber hoses still - will those be affected by the alcohol?? so the fronts probably ok (though I was looking at MC rebuild kits and they aren't that bad...) but the rear and clutch prob needs work. also when you say flush them just do it like a brake bleed almost?? what I can I'll take apart but the calipers would require a rebuild if I took them all the way apart (but is possibly needed)

No, if you tear them all the way down you won't need new seals. Just be careful putting them back in. I believe the edge of the caliper cylinders are tapered to allow for easy installation. I'd spray out the calipers and m/c and then use brake cleaner with the little plastic tube thingy on the nozzle to flush the lines.

Oh, and I don't think the hoses will be affected much by the DOT5. I've just heard the seals are most affected.

really?? i was more concerned with the alcohol. I know my mity vac's hoses are ruined because of the dot 5. if you look at the hoses there's little dots all over the inside.... not exactly sure if that's from silicone build up or it degrading it. but then agian I bet it's a completely diff material then the brake lines. i can take a pic to show you. also denatured alcohol? i gotta dig up the article but i remember reading somewhere about people who used alcohol to clean their lines after putting dot 5 in and it caused brake failure... i guess though the denatured alcohol isn't supposed to affect the rubber right cause it's safe on seals?? oh and flush them like I do a brake bleed?? I guess though for the brakes and mc I should really try getting them nice and scrubbed clean...

"The single most common brake system failure caused by a contaminant is swelling of the rubber components (piston seals etc.) due to the introduction of petroleum based products (motor oil, power steering fluid, mineral oil etc.) A small amount is enough to do major damage. Flushing with mineral spirits is enough to cause a complete system failure in a short time. I suspect this is what has happened when some BMW owners changed to DOT 5 (and then assumed that silicone caused the problem). Flushing with alcohol also causes problems. BMW brake systems should be flushed only with DOT 3 or 4.

If silicone is introduced into an older brake system, the silicone will latch unto the sludge generated by gradual component deterioration and create a gelatin like goop which will attract more crud and eventually plug up metering orifices or cause pistons to stick. If you have already changed to DOT 5, don't compound your initial mistake and change back. Silicone is very tenacious stuff and you will never get it all out of your system. Just change the fluid regularly. For those who race using silicone fluid, I recommend that you crack the bleed screws before each racing session to insure that there is no water in the calipers."

that's what I've been basing things off of.... :-\

Denatured alcohol is not mineral spirits. Like I said, if it were me, I would just use brake cleaner. I know that is safe for rubber. Just make sure and blow the parts dry with compressed air, if available.

Like I said before. :wink:

yeah. i'll probably throw my old front brake ss lines on (they're fine but the casing is ripped, granted my newer ones did the same thing somehow) as well as cleaning them out part by part... what should I do for the calipers and MC? just flush or try and take apart and scrub clean?

Lemme guess, they're Galfers. Mine did the same thing. They are difficult to route. I ended up swapping the little brackets off the fender recently to get the right angles. Had to tweak one of them just so. Seems the Galfers could use an extra inch or so.

Hey! Didn't "she" say that. Hehehehe