dead hawk -I'm stuck!!!!!!
09-03-2008, 09:37 AM
#1
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dead hawk -I'm stuck!!!!!!
fueled bike, wouldn't start. gotta jump to get home. Found that battery is being drained by odometer fuse/related. Pull the fuse, no more drain. i've seen several references to this problem, but non that ID'd the problem.
Is there anyone out there who can shed some light?
thanx
Is there anyone out there who can shed some light?
thanx
09-03-2008, 12:17 PM
#2
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Could be a bad R/R (rectifier/regulator) the older non finned versions die pretty often. Search on here for more info and if you do replace it get a later one (2001 on iirc) with cooling fins on it as a direct plug in replacement or go for a beefier gsxr unit - that option will require some rewiring. Unplug it and see if the battery drain goes away. There is a downloadable service manual link in the knowledgebase that gives troubleshooting tips.
fueled bike, wouldn't start. gotta jump to get home. Found that battery is being drained by odometer fuse/related. Pull the fuse, no more drain. i've seen several references to this problem, but non that ID'd the problem.
Is there anyone out there who can shed some light?
thanx
Is there anyone out there who can shed some light?
thanx
09-03-2008, 01:37 PM
#3
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thanx Rick,
I bought a new finned RR (figuring that it was the likely culprit) and mounted it with longer bolts and placed nuts between the back of the RR and the mounting plate so that air could travel behind it. This leaves a 1/4" airway behind the RR. I don,t know if this is good or not, but it seems reasonable to me. Anyway, I unplugged the RR and the battery draw remains until I take the odometer fuse is removed.
I tested various components according to my Shop Manual to no avail. I even ran a hot and ground wires to the instrument cluster and the battery still shows a drain. So, if that test is relevant, the problem may be the instrument cluster, but who can spend several big ones to chance that?
thank you for your help and I'll post any results I learn.
nathan
I bought a new finned RR (figuring that it was the likely culprit) and mounted it with longer bolts and placed nuts between the back of the RR and the mounting plate so that air could travel behind it. This leaves a 1/4" airway behind the RR. I don,t know if this is good or not, but it seems reasonable to me. Anyway, I unplugged the RR and the battery draw remains until I take the odometer fuse is removed.
I tested various components according to my Shop Manual to no avail. I even ran a hot and ground wires to the instrument cluster and the battery still shows a drain. So, if that test is relevant, the problem may be the instrument cluster, but who can spend several big ones to chance that?
thank you for your help and I'll post any results I learn.
nathan
09-03-2008, 11:04 PM
#4
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Check this thread out regarding odometer current drain...
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...start+odometer
and this one too...
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...start+odometer
I wonder what others have done to mitigate the R/R problem. I too assumed that it was heat related. I cleaned the mount real well and used some computer heat sink compound between the mounting plate and the back of the R/R. I remember someone mounting a CPU fan the the R/R... What have others done and have you felt it was successful? 
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...start+odometer
and this one too...
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...start+odometer
thanx Rick,
I bought a new finned RR (figuring that it was the likely culprit) and mounted it with longer bolts and placed nuts between the back of the RR and the mounting plate so that air could travel behind it. This leaves a 1/4" airway behind the RR. I don,t know if this is good or not, but it seems reasonable to me.
nathan
I bought a new finned RR (figuring that it was the likely culprit) and mounted it with longer bolts and placed nuts between the back of the RR and the mounting plate so that air could travel behind it. This leaves a 1/4" airway behind the RR. I don,t know if this is good or not, but it seems reasonable to me.
nathan
Last edited by RonVTR; 09-03-2008 at 11:11 PM.
09-04-2008, 12:43 AM
#5
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I bought a new finned RR (figuring that it was the likely culprit) and mounted it with longer bolts and placed nuts between the back of the RR and the mounting plate so that air could travel behind it. This leaves a 1/4" airway behind the RR. I don,t know if this is good or not, but it seems reasonable to me.
09-04-2008, 05:26 AM
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inderocker,
thnx for the reply. you may be correct about the flushmount heat dissipation theory, but the jury's still out in my opinion, especially considering the heat build-up in the sub-frame because of its behind-the-engine placement. I'll let you know how it works out when I remove the seat after a long, hot ride and check for myself.
what I'd also like to know is odometer fuse/ battery drain relationship. do you have any insights?
thanx, nathan
thnx for the reply. you may be correct about the flushmount heat dissipation theory, but the jury's still out in my opinion, especially considering the heat build-up in the sub-frame because of its behind-the-engine placement. I'll let you know how it works out when I remove the seat after a long, hot ride and check for myself.
what I'd also like to know is odometer fuse/ battery drain relationship. do you have any insights?
thanx, nathan
09-04-2008, 06:59 AM
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RonVTR,
thank you for the references. I saw these and they were helpful, esp the Aussie post.
However, I haven't been able to make the odometer fuse/ battery drain connection. I am running with a new RR(finned from Rick's elactrical in NH) and I removed the odometer fuse until I can determine the the issue. Unless the draw is normal draw to hold the memory in which case I'll re-insert the fuse and give it another go.
thanx,
nathan
thank you for the references. I saw these and they were helpful, esp the Aussie post.
However, I haven't been able to make the odometer fuse/ battery drain connection. I am running with a new RR(finned from Rick's elactrical in NH) and I removed the odometer fuse until I can determine the the issue. Unless the draw is normal draw to hold the memory in which case I'll re-insert the fuse and give it another go.
thanx,
nathan
09-04-2008, 10:36 AM
#9
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For a short term fix you probably could put in a switch between the fuse and the load terminal to turn it off when the bike is not running. Some draw is normal but anything over a few hundred milliamps sounds excessive.
09-04-2008, 11:41 AM
#10
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Hey guys
I dont mean to steal this thread but seeing this post made me ask some questions:
- I drive abt 10 miles (minimum) a day
- If I leave the lights on for more than a minute, the battery drains
- If I dont ride for a few days the battery drains
Are these normal?
Should I try to test if there is any odometer or other drains?
If yes, Can someone please instruct me how? I am a new rider and I would like to know how from someone above me in expereince,
Cheers
Vasaq
PS: I have replaced the R/R before and the bike starts fine etc.
I dont mean to steal this thread but seeing this post made me ask some questions:
- I drive abt 10 miles (minimum) a day
- If I leave the lights on for more than a minute, the battery drains
- If I dont ride for a few days the battery drains
Are these normal?
Should I try to test if there is any odometer or other drains?
If yes, Can someone please instruct me how? I am a new rider and I would like to know how from someone above me in expereince,
Cheers
Vasaq
PS: I have replaced the R/R before and the bike starts fine etc.
09-05-2008, 05:56 AM
#11
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the odometer drain on my battery is enough to render it dead in a few days. this has never happened in the 7 years I've owned the 98 hawk. naturally, you might expect that the memory drain would use a negligible amt. If I can't find a resolution other than replacing the costly instrument cluster, i will certainly follow Rick's switch suggestion.
vasaq, if you have a shop manual, it describes how to check for a battery draw. basically:
- disconnect the neg terminal from the battery
- touch the pos multimeter lead to the disconnected neg cable
- and the neg multimeter lead to the neg battery terminal
- you will likely see a several amp draw until you remove the odometer fuse
I haven't found the specific problem yet, but:
- I disconnected the plugs from the instrument cluster so that it was connected to nothing
- then connected a wire directly from the pos battery terminal to the red/g wire of the instrument cluster
- the multimeter, connected as stated above to check for draw, showed the draw was originating somewhere in the instrument cluster
that's if my direct wire experiment correct?
thanx for all input. I appreciate the suggestions/comments.
nathan
vasaq, if you have a shop manual, it describes how to check for a battery draw. basically:
- disconnect the neg terminal from the battery
- touch the pos multimeter lead to the disconnected neg cable
- and the neg multimeter lead to the neg battery terminal
- you will likely see a several amp draw until you remove the odometer fuse
I haven't found the specific problem yet, but:
- I disconnected the plugs from the instrument cluster so that it was connected to nothing
- then connected a wire directly from the pos battery terminal to the red/g wire of the instrument cluster
- the multimeter, connected as stated above to check for draw, showed the draw was originating somewhere in the instrument cluster
that's if my direct wire experiment correct?
thanx for all input. I appreciate the suggestions/comments.
nathan
09-05-2008, 07:01 AM
#12
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Vasaq - First test the charging system per the manual to make sure its working right but your issue sounds like a tired battery.
Hey guys
I dont mean to steal this thread but seeing this post made me ask some questions:
- I drive abt 10 miles (minimum) a day
- If I leave the lights on for more than a minute, the battery drains
- If I dont ride for a few days the battery drains
Are these normal?
Should I try to test if there is any odometer or other drains?
If yes, Can someone please instruct me how? I am a new rider and I would like to know how from someone above me in expereince,
Cheers
Vasaq
PS: I have replaced the R/R before and the bike starts fine etc.
I dont mean to steal this thread but seeing this post made me ask some questions:
- I drive abt 10 miles (minimum) a day
- If I leave the lights on for more than a minute, the battery drains
- If I dont ride for a few days the battery drains
Are these normal?
Should I try to test if there is any odometer or other drains?
If yes, Can someone please instruct me how? I am a new rider and I would like to know how from someone above me in expereince,
Cheers
Vasaq
PS: I have replaced the R/R before and the bike starts fine etc.
09-05-2008, 05:40 PM
#14
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I went through all of this a few weeks ago. Not the R/R, it was replaced last year and the symptoms are much different. If my bike sits 3+ days, or if I leave the lights on for a few minutes it won't start. Charging system checks out fine. The odometer does draw .4Ma, but even with the battery disconnected it will still go from 13.5v to 12.5 overnight. I think that after being in the bike for 10 years, it's time for a new one. For now, if I don't get to ride on the weekend, I'll hook it up to the trickle charger overnight. It's getting a brand new Yuasa for Christmas!
09-06-2008, 10:52 AM
#15
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After 10 years that battery doesn't owe you a thing 
I put my bikes on the battery minder when it won't be ridden for a while, seems to prolong battery life in my experiences.
I put my bikes on the battery minder when it won't be ridden for a while, seems to prolong battery life in my experiences.
I went through all of this a few weeks ago. Not the R/R, it was replaced last year and the symptoms are much different. If my bike sits 3+ days, or if I leave the lights on for a few minutes it won't start. Charging system checks out fine. The odometer does draw .4Ma, but even with the battery disconnected it will still go from 13.5v to 12.5 overnight. I think that after being in the bike for 10 years, it's time for a new one. For now, if I don't get to ride on the weekend, I'll hook it up to the trickle charger overnight. It's getting a brand new Yuasa for Christmas!
09-07-2008, 08:50 PM
#16
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yeah, my battery tender went south about a year ago and i bought another brand that not only charges but cleans the plates too. So far I haven't bought a battery for any bike since i've been floating.
anyway, thanks for all the help and when or if i discover the odometer drain, i'll post it for others.
thanx, nathan
anyway, thanks for all the help and when or if i discover the odometer drain, i'll post it for others.
thanx, nathan
09-28-2008, 07:25 PM
#17
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update on the dead hawk problem!!!!
I replaced the R/R with a Rick's unit and pulled the odometer fuse so that there was no battery drain. I figured my problems were over. Several days later, the bike wouldn't start after an hour ride. I pulled the battery and got a ride to an Advance Auto. They tested the battery and it was shot. Now I have a new battery and a new R/R. I assume I'll be able to replace the odometer as that likely isn't the problem. Time will tell.
I discovered something relative to jump-starting the hawk. Twice I failed before I figured out that you can't catch it in gear to start it because there must be an electrical circuit that prevents starting in without the clutch engaged unless it is in neutral. That means that there must be an electrical connector somewhere that must be disconnected before jump-starting the hawk. This same connector will not allow you to jump the battery if it's in gear, thank god because that would cause the bike to fall off the sidestand.
I'll have to find that connector in case i need to catch it in gear again. if I have further revelations on the electrical problem and/or the connector, I'll post.
I replaced the R/R with a Rick's unit and pulled the odometer fuse so that there was no battery drain. I figured my problems were over. Several days later, the bike wouldn't start after an hour ride. I pulled the battery and got a ride to an Advance Auto. They tested the battery and it was shot. Now I have a new battery and a new R/R. I assume I'll be able to replace the odometer as that likely isn't the problem. Time will tell.
I discovered something relative to jump-starting the hawk. Twice I failed before I figured out that you can't catch it in gear to start it because there must be an electrical circuit that prevents starting in without the clutch engaged unless it is in neutral. That means that there must be an electrical connector somewhere that must be disconnected before jump-starting the hawk. This same connector will not allow you to jump the battery if it's in gear, thank god because that would cause the bike to fall off the sidestand.
I'll have to find that connector in case i need to catch it in gear again. if I have further revelations on the electrical problem and/or the connector, I'll post.
09-29-2008, 02:55 PM
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Technically you'd rather have that part of the heat sink in contact with the metal frame. That will dissipate heat better than airflow over it.
09-29-2008, 06:30 PM
#21
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i'll have to stop and pull the seat to find out how hot the sub-frame is on a hot day/extended ride.
anyway, it may be a moot point since they upgraded the RR with fins and maybe external heat is irrelevant. smarter people than me will have to answer these questions.
thanks for the input.
09-30-2008, 06:53 AM
#23
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I dont think "That means that there must be an electrical connector somewhere that must be disconnected before jump-starting the hawk. " is true. I am like the king of jump-starting around where I live...I had a bad battery and had to drive in winter and didnt have the money to buy a new one. That winter I jumpstarted the bike atleast a 100 times....there is no circuit or connector to be disconnected before jump starting the hawk. You just have to run hard ...and engage the second gear and the bikes comes to life even before the clutch is fully engaged
09-30-2008, 06:18 PM
#24
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I dont think "That means that there must be an electrical connector somewhere that must be disconnected before jump-starting the hawk. " is true. I am like the king of jump-starting around where I live...I had a bad battery and had to drive in winter and didnt have the money to buy a new one. That winter I jumpstarted the bike atleast a 100 times....there is no circuit or connector to be disconnected before jump starting the hawk. You just have to run hard ...and engage the second gear and the bikes comes to life even before the clutch is fully engaged
thanks for the info.
nathan
10-02-2008, 07:50 PM
#26
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I tried to push start my 91 corolla a while back and it wouldn't start until I disconnected the cluch switch and I thought maybe the hawk had some similar switch.
anyway thanks for the solution.
nathan
10-02-2008, 08:11 PM
#27
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I dont think "That means that there must be an electrical connector somewhere that must be disconnected before jump-starting the hawk. " is true. I am like the king of jump-starting around where I live...I had a bad battery and had to drive in winter and didnt have the money to buy a new one. That winter I jumpstarted the bike atleast a 100 times....there is no circuit or connector to be disconnected before jump starting the hawk. You just have to run hard ...and engage the second gear and the bikes comes to life even before the clutch is fully engaged
I used to run through knoxville often on I 40 and I 81. I drove a semi long haul for twenty years and that was one my favorite routes south and west. nice country with lots of mountains and great roads.
thanks again, nathan
10-03-2008, 05:43 PM
#28
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i can attest to the hawk not having a circuit to prevent pop starting, i can't start in first cause the wheel locks, but i can start in 2nd, like someone else said, you just hafta run real fast..run until you think it's going fast enough then run for another 10 seconds or so until you almost fall over and jump on there and try to time your clutch release with your weight hitting the bike for a little extra traction and she'll fire off 
10-04-2008, 06:23 AM
#29
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[QUOTE=quakefiend420;184040]i can attest to the hawk not having a circuit to prevent pop starting, i can't start in first cause the wheel locks, but i can start in 2nd, like someone else said, you just hafta run real fast..run until you think it's going fast enough then run for another 10 seconds or so until you almost fall over and jump on there and try to time your clutch release with your weight hitting the bike for a little extra traction and she'll fire off
yeah, I was incorrect about the toyota-like switch that prevents push-starts. I did start the hawk in 3rd but didn't coordinate bouncing down on the seat with releasing the clutch which probably gives the added traction to effect a second gear start.
I must be getting wimpy or maybe too used to the dependable starters of the jap bikes. I haven't had to jump start a bike since the 60's when I roadraced a
350cc ducati a Summit Point, but on the other hand the duck wasn't 500lbs.
thanks, nathan
yeah, I was incorrect about the toyota-like switch that prevents push-starts. I did start the hawk in 3rd but didn't coordinate bouncing down on the seat with releasing the clutch which probably gives the added traction to effect a second gear start.
I must be getting wimpy or maybe too used to the dependable starters of the jap bikes. I haven't had to jump start a bike since the 60's when I roadraced a
350cc ducati a Summit Point, but on the other hand the duck wasn't 500lbs.
thanks, nathan
10-05-2008, 12:43 AM
#30
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inderocker said the same thing earlier on this forum.
i'll have to stop and pull the seat to find out how hot the sub-frame is on a hot day/extended ride.
anyway, it may be a moot point since they upgraded the RR with fins and maybe external heat is irrelevant. smarter people than me will have to answer these questions.
thanks for the input.
i'll have to stop and pull the seat to find out how hot the sub-frame is on a hot day/extended ride.
anyway, it may be a moot point since they upgraded the RR with fins and maybe external heat is irrelevant. smarter people than me will have to answer these questions.
thanks for the input.
