What kind of putty to repair leak from oil pan?
 

At the risk of sounding like an ultra-n00b.... what kind of putty do you guys use to repair cracks to the clutch cover and/or oil pan?

I just picked up a '98 vtr 1000 firestorm via straight trade for my 2001 zx6r ninja. The old bike had a rebuild title but had lots of go-fast goodies, the new bike is bone-stock with only 5,400 kms.

The problem with the "new" bike is that it had obviously been down... it has a scuff on the headlight, plastic above the mirrors is cracked and the gear shift lever was bent. I'm not too worried about the tw minor cracks in the plastics and I was able to bend the gear shift level back to the correct angle.

My problem now is that I have two oil leaks. One leak is out of the cam chain tensioners which seems to be normal for our bikes. I'm guessing an APE manual kit will fix this.

The other leak is at the back of the oil pan. THe previous owner had put some grey putty to try to stop the leak (which I didn't see when I was checking out the bike) but every time I come home from a ride I accumulate a few drops of oil from whatever is behind that putty.

My ultimate plan is to drop the oil pan on next oil change and re-seal the pan.

So my two questions are:
What kind of putty do you guys use? (brand please)
Is there any special kind of sealant to use on the oil pan?

Thanks,
Jim

it should be fixed the correct way so if the cover is damaged it should be repaired/welded or replaced. Also there should not be any need for a putty as a sealant since the gasket is an oring type if I remember correctly at any rate even if it isn't it is not a good idea to use a rtv sealant or similar on motorcycles because of the risk that a small piece of liquid gasket could end coming loose and then block one of the smaller oil passages found on bike engines.

JB Weld

I must admit, it's fixed more than one part for me over the years. Don't expect it a 100% leak-free repair, but it should work for a season or two if done right. Just don't span the mounting between the pan and the crankcase or you'll never get the pan off again!

+1 on JB Weld. It's incredible what that stuff can fix. But clean it real well first. Carb spray should work for cleaning, or acetone.

And with the o-ring gasket, either use nothing (a light film of oil spread with your finger is okay), or you could use some 3M Weatherstrip Adhesive, or something similar...but as Little Horse said, never silicone.

really? ive always RTV'd my oil pan gaskets with no furture problems. but isnt that what the strainer/filter are for?

i had an '89 nt650 that had a crack on the side of the radiator. used jb weld, never leaked again. depending on where the crack is and how bad, it is best to replace the part.

You've been lucky.

The main problem is that people use too damn much of that stuff, and it doesn't breakdown. About 30 years ago one of my auto students had bad lifter noise on an Olds 442 V8. He said he'd just replaced the lifters the previous weekend. He used RTV silicone on the intake manifold. I told him that the oil supply was probably blocked. When he pulled it back off and blew out the oil passageways that feed the lifters, a chunk of orange silicone came flying out.

oh, i usually barely use any. just a thin film applied with my finger for added seal.

Actually there is no gasket or "o" ring on the oil pan, just a small amount of Hondabond. ;)

Wait if its just Honda bond then why are people saying no silicone? That's all its is is high temp silicone

Because most don't realize that there is no oil pan gasket.

As for fixing the old one, well you can buy a brand new pan for $131 (Honda, ATV Parts, Scooter Parts, Motorcycle Parts,CRF,CR,MX Parts, Goldwing parts)

and a used one can be had for much less so why would you want to mess around with a hillbilly fix that might come loose and coat the rear tire with oil at an unknown time. :eek:

A number of vehicles built in the last 30 or so years don't use gaskets where you would expect one. I like o-ring gaskets, since they never leak if installed properly. But that costs more, both for the gasket itself and for machining the groove the o-ring fits into. That's why most American manufacturers don't use them.

There are many different types of RTV silicone. If you use the right type and don't use it excessively, just a small bead, you should be okay.

Just don't use that orange crap...it looks like hell.

i actually just cleaned all that shit off lol

If I use RTV on a car, I like Permatex Ultra Grey. But for my bike I think I'd go to the dealer and spring for the Hondabond, or ask the service department what they use.

see we all learn something everyday, no wonder I couldn't find an oil pan gasket in the microfiche :rolleyes:

Thanks for all the replies guys!

I didn't even bother looking into the microfiches because I knew I would be dissapointed with the price that I would find... but as the above post correctly points out, it is only $130 for a brand new pan.

Next time I'm out I'll see what the stealership charges for Hondabond, otherwise I'll try to find some JB weld. Currently the putty that is on the oil pan is spanning the pan and crankcase, and as the above post mentioned, I should try to avoid doing that span with JB weld.

Would JB weld work inside to the pan to fill a possible crack?

If it's cracked, JB weld will probably work, if you can get all of the oil off. Try grinding some aluminum away, for a clean, rough surface.

To seal the pan to the case, +1 on Hondabond. It is not even close to the same as silicone RTV. RTV pinches off and ends up in the oil pickup screen. It also squeezes out to the outside and makes you look like an ameteur. A thin coat of Hondabond on clean, dry surfaces is the right way to do it.

I have had a crack in an oil pan for years and I sealed it with "Quicksteel". It sounds like what the previous owner used. Comes in a tube with silver paper on the inside, sold at a lot of auto parts places.

The only reason I ever used the stuff was because the oil is so integral to... everything in my car. If it were any easier to get at I would have replaced it years ago. (brief summation of items to remove from car to swap oil pan; front driveshaft, front diff, front half shafts, front suspension, front subframe including steering rack, and you are there!)

Ok, I've gathered all the stuff I need to fix the pan.

Oil
Oil Filter
HondaBond
JB Weld
Razor blades to clean off the sealant

So here is my next n00b question...

Is it safe to apply JB Weld on the inside of the oil pan? I still haven't taken the pan off yet, but I'm thinking that I might find a crack and knowing myself I would probably want to put JB weld on both sides of the crack. Can I do this?

I don't think that would be a problem, but do as JB Weld recommends...let it cure for at least 24 hours. And make sure you mix equal parts and mix it well.

Also, as mentioned above, clean really well (acetone would work) and grind some material off. You might even want to grind a slight groove along the crack, then fill it with JB Weld.

Good luck.

JB weld becomes inert to anything it'll encounter on the oil pan once it is fully cured. not only is it safe to apply to the inside of the pan, but you will want to apply it to the inside of the pan in order to properly repair the crack. inside and outslde. i wonder how the hell the previous owner managed to put a crack in the rear of the oil pan...

i like JB weld. the original non-quick curing one. it has made my day more than once.
but, if it was my bike, i'd still just ditch the repair idea and pick up a used, undamaged one on ebay.

Hey guys,

Sorry for reviving this older discussion...

I finally decided to repair my oil pan leak the correct way and found an oil pan on ebay for $30.

Part of the delay was that I also had to find/order the proper "standard" pit bull rear stand pads (for swing arm to sit on instead of spindles). I finally got those orderd and they should be here this week.

I also said WTH and bought Kreigger manual CCT's. It was a pleasure doing business with Mark. Although I have not received the CCTs yet, Mark was very communicative. I had some oil leaking out of the rear cct since it is alway bathed in oil and the bike has less than 6,000km on it... so the seals are probably pooched.

I should be getting everything delivered this week and I'll let you know how it goes.

Jim

:thumbsup: I 1000% agree with you. If it came out the factory with no silicone on it, what they hell are you putting silicone on it now for. I think it also looks terrible when you look at an engine, or any part for that matter, that has a bunch of silicone ozzing out of every mating surface. It makes you look like a damn shade tree mechanic.

So I finally dropped the oil pan, which of course means removing exhaust, and dumping the oil (not in that order).

I cleaned the pan up nicely and checked for any scratches or cracks in the pan and found none. I applied some hondabond semi-liquid gasket and buttoned it back up. I thought everything was fine (ie: leaked fixed) until everything got sloshed around on my test ride. One hour after the test ride, the back of the oil pan was leaking again.

I looked closed at the back of the crankcase and found there was still some JB weld from the previous owner. I chipped off the JB weld and could see the leak forming from where the pan meets the bottom of the motor. Everything looks perfectly flat, but obvisouly something is torqued a bit. I ended up applying lots of jb weld and its been curing since Tuesday.

While waiting for the JB weld to cure I started tackling the CCTs... but when I tried to removed the alternator centre cap I ended up stripping the hole. I took me about 1.5 hours spread over two nights to dremel and drill out the plug. I ordered a new one, but the idiots at Honda ordered the smaller alternator cover that covers the timing marks instead of the correct centre cover. But they did get the proper o-ring, which makes me think WTF. So, basically I will lose a long weekend of ridign this weekend. What a mess. I should have kept my ninja 600 till the end of this season.

just put oil in and don't make left turns, it'll be fine

Dont know if this was mentioned but there is a new kind of jb weld that is meat to stick better through an oily mess. Its like jb weld metal or iron or titanium. I saw a write up in motorcylce consumer news and they used it on a broken clutch cover with oil and all & it was permanent.

Fixed!!!
 

Guys,

The oil leaks are finally fixed!

I ordered a 1/64 inch gasket from Mr. Gasket (#9610 for reference) and cut my own oil pan gasket and alternator cover gasket too. Since I had purchased a spare oil pan, it was dead simple to cut the oil pan gasket. I didn't have a leather punch to cut bolt holes through the gasket but a paper hole punch (borrowed from work but might not get returned ;-)) worked like a hot damn.

When I had the oil pan off I used a straight edge to see if anything looked off and sure enough the block (not the pan) had about a 0.5mm deflection over a 7cm straight run right where the oil was leaking from. I used JB weld to fill-in the gap and knowing that my problem would be fixed I still used the home-brew gasket since I took all the time to make it.

The bike started up fine and after the oil residue off the header/muffler tubes smoked off, everything looked good.

So to wrap this thread up this is everything that was fixed (or at least fixed because I broke it during the "repair"):
Oil pan leak... fixed
leaking cct... fixed
alternator cover leak... gasket broken due to stripping the alternator cap when fixing the cct... fixed.
spark plugs... changed out while whole bike was apart
oil change... already had all the oil out with pan off

Lessons learned:
That stupid stopper tool "needed" to remove the ccts was the biggest PITA. I made two tools and both twisted under the cct spring load. If I were to do ccts again, I would have measured how far the cct plunger was compressed by referencing the distance on a screw driver... ie: stick in the screw driver, and mark with a line how far the screw driver went into the cct. And then with cct off I would have transferred that plunger compression depth to the new manual cct.

Total cost of this much lengthier than expected project:
JB weld - $15
HondaBond - $20ish (i can't remember)
Alternator cap cover - $18
Alternator cap o-ring - $3
oil pan from ebay - $60 ($30 for pan $30 for shipping)
gasket material - $25 (most of it was shipping)
cylinder head cover bolt - $8
Kreigger ccts - $85
Oil change - $50 or so (filter and oil)
Spark plugs - $25

Now I can go ride the piss off the bike before the season is almost over.... I still haven't broken in my new Alpinestars boots!