Re: (Installing!) VTR1000 SP1 wheels on my Superhawk?
 

Well FINALLY getting back to this! Don't blame me, blame the girlfriend! Bought me an RC airplane and I got sidetracked for a few months :)

http://mafat.ath.cx/newfront.jpg

I came up short a few fasteners, and managed to misplace my left clipon (feeling REALLY dumb about that) so 95% complete! Will hit the Honda shop the next day or so for a few bolts, and will continue to dig in the garage until I find the other bar :)

My friend re-tapped the wheels and put some nice, swanky titanium OZ bolts in they sent over for my troubles. Wheel is in, calipers are on and drag a little bit more then I'd like. We'll see what a slow half mile ride does for that.

Originally I'd just rattle canned that fender so it was all one color, but that dark gray front is starting to grow on me...

Using the 929 clipons at the moment, on top, with the forks only half way up the clipon. Seems to have plenty of fork to bite on so not worried about them coming off. Didn't want to skewer the geometry any more then necessary by pushing them to far up in the tree.

I recall the front axle not being flush on the left side when all together last time, so mildly concerned about the fact it is now. WIll investigate that a little more.

If this all checks out, I should be getting to the rear (which most likely will be easier!!!) next time we get a spat of bad weather :)

What a tease, I thought this was going to be the I'm all done post. :evil:

Its getting there! So far, I'm VERY happy with the change! Ride is firmer, but not harsh. Handling is definately better with quicker turn in and less effort needed. Brakes are better too! Get more stopping power for my effort on the lever.

Weather looks good for the near future, so time to rack up some miles!

looks really sick.....I like it alot.....alot.....haha......almost looks ducatish.....

Hey!! Where are you at with this now?

Bike will be heading to my friends place around next week so we can get going on the spacers. Painted the interior of my house, put down some pergo floors and did a bunch of work to the yard so haven't been wrenching much this year :( Soon to change I hope!

:) Bump and Join

mdbuehler.... did you ever get the rear wheel to work with a stock swingarm?

Back at it! :) I've taken care of all my other projects, and before the girlfriend makes me refinish the kitchen, my Hawk gets my undivided attention! Have a HID kit, undertail, CBR gauge set and a tail light mod on the way, and perhaps a paint job when its all together :)

I've tracked down the other parts needed for the rear wheel, just short bearings and the spacer. Since I'm using the Hawk axle, I'll need bearings with the inner diameter as the Hawk, but the outer of the SP1 wheels.

The Hawk uses 6204UU for the rear bearing 20mm inner, 47mm outer x 14mm depth

The RC51 uses a 6005 bearing, looks like 25mm inner, 47mm outer x 12mm depth

Would not having that extra 2mm of depth cause much a problem? Looks easy enough to swap out for stock Hawk bearings if thats the case!

Hawk is up on stands and apart. Taking more measurements on the rear wheel. Bearings are the same size outer, so ordered a new set of Hawk bearings, and I'll just put those in the OZ wheel.

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/cbr2.jpg

The spacer in the wheel I may be lucky on as well. Measuring through the wheel to the outer edges of the bearings, the Hawk is almost exactly 4mm wider then the OZ, and since the two bearings are 2mm narrower, the spacer may be the same length just a different diameter. Ordered another Hawk spacer, and will verify that when it arrives. Two parts easy anyway!

Now for the sprocket hub bit:

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/cbr1.jpg

Very different from the Hawks, and the bearing here is a different size, and has that tubular metal insert that is the wrong diameter as well. For this it looks like I could have a machine shop just make me an insert that will bring the diameter down to the Hawk's axle size, then I just pop this right back on the wheel and go on my way.

Will call around tomorrow and see what my options are.

i hope you eventually end up selling that wheel setup because they are the secks

Good luck. I do not know enough about wheel bearings/loads etc to know the different issues to be concerned with here. I'm sure there is the expertise on the board somewhere that can address. Calling a local bearings shop will get you access to all bearings by spec so you can see if there is a correct OD/ID/Depth out there to similar load specs as the stock ones.

If there is a successful swap out there it will open up a whole set of options - particularly for those that have done the front end swap already so that wheel is just a direct replacement.

It looks like its just going to come down to a few easily made parts! :) Back from the shop where they knocked the bearings out of the old hawk wheel and the new OZ one. I'll get pics up when I get home, but the news is good.

Right side bearing is a straight swap if you want. Its the same OD, so the Hawk can drop right in.

Left side bearing for some odd reason (maybe just on the OZ) is quite a bit larger OD. Either an insert, or just buying a new bearing with the correct OD/ID will work. Mulling those options now.

The inner wheel spacer is about 1mm shorter on the Hawk then the OZ wheel (OZ is way fancier too, aluminium with 3 'edges'). A simple 1mm x 17mm spacer will fill the gap.

The sprocket carrier bearing is HUGE, lol! Honda put there own insert in it to bring it down to size, and we knocked that out so all I need is to take that to a machinist and have them make the exact same part, just 20mm ID instead of 25mm.

So total parts needed:

Custom insert for sprocket carrier bearing

Left side bearing with correct OD/ID OR insert

1mm spacer for inner-wheel spacer

Handful of 17mm ID spacers to center things up


Not so bad! Once I get a part made that works, I'll see if I can get the cad file to go with it and post it along with the bearing part #s.

that sounds encouraging. anxious to see the pics etc. thanks

Really good actually, I may need no machining at all now :)

From the CBR sprocket carrier / OZ wheel side of things (sorry about large pics, easier to read!):

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/OZCBR.jpg

Guts of a Superhawk wheel, nothing new here:

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/hawkb.jpg

Seriously bummed about the inner wheel spacer, .7mm short! I'll need to find a thiiiinnn washer to bridge that gap!

Looking at bearingsdirect.com:

Left OZ replacement : 20 x 14 x 47

http://bearingsdirect.com/store/inde...t_detail&p=232

Right OZ replacement : Superhawk bearing is the plan here, drops right in

CBR Sprocket bearing : 20 x 52 x 22.2

http://bearingsdirect.com/store/inde...t_detail&p=619

The nice thing about that one is the inner is 20mm, so the whole insert problem goes away altogether. Not sure why Honda even bothered unless they happened to have a few million laying around and the insert was cheaper then buying the right size?

Bearings have arrived! :) I'll start getting that together this evening with the spacer. Bike is torn to pieces for swingarm / frame painting, so may be the weekend before I get a chance to mount things up and start working on the alignment. Moving along!

Behold!!

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/wheel.jpg

Do not adjust your monitor, what you are seeing is actually true. Several years after it began, before you sits an RC51 OZ HL-02 on a Superhawk axle :)

Its actually very easy, purely by luck it seems. The insert into the larger sprocket bearing had a 13mm extension on it, which is exactly the same size as one of the Hawk stock spacers, so that dropped right in the center of the cush drive.

The inner wheel spacer turned out to be a moot issue, they are BOTH longer then necessary. One of those bearings doesn't go all the way in, it comes up a mm or two short when it hits the spacer in the wheel. I'd wondered how Honda got that so exact, turns out they didn't :)

The smallest CBR 929 sprocket I could find was a 42 tooth, so 1 up from stock, doubt I'll notice.

The only two issues :

Dust seals are for a larger diameter axle, so won't do much. Fine for now, but will look into that for longetivity reasons.

I smushed one of the actual bearing seals (the metal one, VERY soft :( ) That isn't a perfect seal now, so will replace that sometime soon, but should be OK for a bit.

Last bit to do is get it all centered up, which I'll get moving on as soon as the swingarm / subframe and exhaust are dry!

Wheel looks sweeet. Should look real fine once it's all mounted up. Any idea on the weight difference between the OZs and OEMs?

Their literature says 25% lighter, but not sure. I take them just for their looks ;)

that is 25 percent lighter than stock rc wheels. loads lighter than stock SH wheels

That works out well considering how many times I'm installing then removing the bloody thing to get things centered right ;)

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/w2.jpg

I'll need to pick up a chain alignment tool, as there are to many converging / diverging lines for my eyes to tell if its close. Stringing the chain over the sprockets though, it looks allright, so its not miles off.

http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/w1.jpg

The rear brake holder is contacting the rotor / wheel, so that will need to get ground back about 2mm. It is for sure a tighter fit in there! That will give me a few mm in either direction for wheel centering and aligning the chain. That I'll accomplish by offsetting either the front or rear sprockets with spacers.

Almost there! :)

Done! :) :) :)


http://www.orangearrowskarting.com/done.jpg

Spacing was a little tricky, as were the brakes, but its all on now.

Rear caliper holder had a few protrusions (intentionally there, no idea why) that were hitting the rotor and wheel so ground those off.

The built in spacer on it I ground a few mm off each end to narrow up and give me more lateral space to work with in centering.

The sprocked I flipped over, recessed side down which moved the teeth about 2mm to the inside.

Then I got a stack of 3/4" washers and played with the numbers until it lined up center, the brakes didn't drag and the chain was straight. I'll go back later with those washers and get proper spacers cut, but they look and work fine. Its all torqued up and ready to roll as soon as I finish the other mods.

Can't wait to see if its a notable performance change, I allready like the look! :)

Congrats!!!! Looks great. I'm sure it`ll run nice too (lighter wheels have a ncie effect on handling)