Topless Airbox
I'm attempting to make this age old mod work, but I'll need help from you carb tuning gurus!
particulars: STG1 motor billet long velocity stacks K&N filter no snorkel or top on airbox no plastic heat guard around the carbs 195 front main 200 rear main 55 Slow Jets 3rd position from top for needle clip 2.25 turns out on pilots It cranks and idles nicely but there are issues with mixture up top... I've put just over 100 miles the fresh STG1 motor and it makes good power down low, but after 5K RPMs it seems to ramp up more slowly and stumbles at 7K RPMs. This seems to be more pronounced when motor is warmed up. I'm guessing the mixture is just too rich after 5K RPMs and suspect it may be caused by the weak springs on the slides or mains that are just too big or both... Thanks in advance for your help! |
have you dynoed?
what do plugs look like? please dont guess,you have a lot to lose |
Originally Posted by hawxter996
(Post 277465)
have you dynoed?
what do plugs look like? please dont guess,you have a lot to lose |
Oh, I get it. You're joking, right?
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Originally Posted by RCVTR
(Post 277479)
Oh, I get it. You're joking, right?
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Why not ring up Roger D as he is the one who suggested it? One would imagine he can help guide you in this.....
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Originally Posted by mikstr
(Post 277489)
Why not ring up Roger D as he is the one who suggested it? One would imagine he can help guide you in this.....
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Dyno date is set!
I'll change the oil again and do the dyno run as soon as the rain stops from TD#5 out in the Gulf of Mexico... |
we will be waiting!
could you have a low pressure area under the tank at speed? |
Originally Posted by hawxter996
(Post 277507)
we will be waiting!
could you have a low pressure area under the tank at speed? |
Originally Posted by FL02SupaHawk996
(Post 277508)
Anything is possible...I know I have a low pressure area between my ears:(
damn man you owe me a keyboard! |
Originally Posted by hawxter996
(Post 277509)
damn man you owe me a keyboard!
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i was just wondering if at speed could a low pressure area form?
if so that could throw off the dyno reading,since it would be sitting still. |
Originally Posted by hawxter996
(Post 277514)
i was just wondering if at speed could a low pressure area form?
if so that could throw off the dyno reading,since it would be sitting still. |
At this point (though you know it already, and I admire your commitment to proving for SURE it won't work well) you are in shady territory. If *I* were in your shoes, and dealing with a hand-built performance motor that adds a ton of variables into the equation, I would be wanting to know FOR SURE what my a/f was doing at all times. You are going to hit the nail on the head a lot quicker if you know where you are aiming. To that end, I would install a bung into the exhaust (if it doesn't have one already) and run a wideband O2 sensor, preferably one with data-logging capability. Dyno time is great and all, but really isn't going to simulate real world riding; you're not going to be doing WFO runs in upper gears all the time. You need to know how it is responding in regular riding conditions. With a wideband and the appropriate gauge mounted in the cockpit where you can glance at it, or again, data-log, you will know pretty quickly with less jetting changes whether you can make the modded airbox work, and not endanger your motor in the process. It's worth it weight in gold when tuning a forced induction system, but pretty valuable in general.
They aren't stupid expensive anymore either. -R |
Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277517)
At this point (though you know it already, and I admire your commitment to proving for SURE it won't work well) you are in shady territory. If *I* were in your shoes, and dealing with a hand-built performance motor that adds a ton of variables into the equation, I would be wanting to know FOR SURE what my a/f was doing at all times. You are going to hit the nail on the head a lot quicker if you know where you are aiming. To that end, I would install a bung into the exhaust (if it doesn't have one already) and run a wideband O2 sensor, preferably one with data-logging capability. Dyno time is great and all, but really isn't going to simulate real world riding; you're not going to be doing WFO runs in upper gears all the time. You need to know how it is responding in regular riding conditions. With a wideband and the appropriate gauge mounted in the cockpit where you can glance at it, or again, data-log, you will know pretty quickly with less jetting changes whether you can make the modded airbox work, and not endanger your motor in the process. It's worth it weight in gold when tuning a forced induction system, but pretty valuable in general.
They aren't stupid expensive anymore either. -R |
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Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277517)
Dyno time is great and all, but really isn't going to simulate real world riding; you're not going to be doing WFO runs in upper gears all the time.
-R Speak for yourself...... lol :) |
Originally Posted by mikstr
(Post 277532)
Speak for yourself...... lol :)
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Originally Posted by 8541Hawk
(Post 277536)
Glad I'm not the only one......... ;)
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Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277540)
Weren't you, just yesterday, espousing the virtues of a usable first gear? ;)
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Yeah, but not WFO in 1st, unless you like sitting on your head. ;)
Again, since you seemed to miss MY point, most people don't ride around WFO. So, actually TUNING a bike rather than tuning for WFO on a dyno might be helpful, especially for somebody trying to run a modified airbox, which so far in SH history, hasn't been proven to work so well. Just trying to be helpful. :) -R |
Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277546)
Yeah, but not WFO in 1st, unless you like sitting on your head. ;)
Again, since you seemed to miss MY point, most people don't ride around WFO. So, actually TUNING a bike rather than tuning for WFO on a dyno might be helpful, especially for somebody trying to run a modified airbox, which so far in SH history, hasn't been proven to work so well. Just trying to be helpful. :) -R 'sides anything with big jugs that are topless is a good idea if you ask me... |
Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277546)
Yeah, but not WFO in 1st, unless you like sitting on your head. ;)
Again, since you seemed to miss MY point, most people don't ride around WFO. So, actually TUNING a bike rather than tuning for WFO on a dyno might be helpful, especially for somebody trying to run a modified airbox, which so far in SH history, hasn't been proven to work so well. Just trying to be helpful. :) -R
Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277517)
you're not going to be doing WFO runs in upper gears all the time.
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Originally Posted by Tweety
(Post 277547)
Well... I'd like mine running right all the way, but that's just me...;)
'sides anything with big jugs that are topless is a good idea if you ask me... |
Originally Posted by 8541Hawk
(Post 277548)
Well it was a bit of humor is response to this quote:
You didn't say anything about 1st gear until later..... I know you're still a bit miffed about the carb heat discussion (or you would be giving mikstr a hard time also, as i just agreed to his comment) but come on, you are really trying to split hairs here. I'm over the carb heat thing, but you're right, I've got a pretty hairy head, so there's always plenty of hairs to split. :) |
Originally Posted by wyldryce
(Post 277550)
Yeah, dyno time is useful too, I was just advocating for knowing what it was doing all the time ;)
Besides a wideband is usefull... I have one... But I also have a dyno... ;) |
Originally Posted by Tweety
(Post 277557)
No problem, I know what you meant, and I agree to a point... But you can tune for a lot more than WFO on a dyno if you know what you are doing... Altought the typical dyno operator is used to tuning IL4's at WFO, so you get what you pay for (at least sometimes)...
Besides a wideband is usefull... I have one... But I also have a dyno... ;) |
Update
While waiting to get a dyno run I leaned up the mains:
running airbox lid & snorkel 190 front main 195 rear main 55 Slow Jets 3rd position from top for needle clip 2.25 turns out on pilots Results are much better power w/o hesitation all the way to redline, but if WOT then I get a stutter around 7-8K RPM, so next mains going in will be 185&190 before the dyno run so she will make max hp&torque for the dyno run:cool: |
so would you want to sell those 200/195 mains? :) or if you have another 190...:rolleyes:
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