horrible noise. Head rebuilt.
11-06-2016, 09:53 AM
#1
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Posts: 345
horrible noise. Head rebuilt.
I will go through the history of this and what happened in two seprate paragraphs.
Reassembly: I got new valves but the shims did not come close to spec so we nicked them down a few tenths of a mm on the exhaust. They were too tight even with small shims. Ended up taking .20 off the valve and going with 192.5 shims as per factory.
Clearence was .16 intake and .35 and .36 on the exaust. They had been lapped in the day before.
head was taken home and torqued using a scale instead of a proper wrench. by the time conversion was done head bolts were at 10kg and the cams at 8kg. which should be ok as they felt ok.
Engine was set to tdc after the combustion stroke of the rear. rear intake cam pointing up at front tdc.
TIming was set with the exaust cam in the front slightly canted counter clockwise about half a tooth. but making a straight line on the cam gears.
Manual cct was made using a tap and a bolt into the auto housing retaining the stock foot.
several spins were made with a wrench to make sure the valves would not crash. Compression felt weak but I figured that it was due to the head being a bit dry and valves being new.
I hit the starter and all felt fine and sounded good. but front sounds quiet.
I test fired and the front seemed loud.
Reassembled it put fuel in and front is making valve noise. Not a scream and not a loosening cct but almost like a pipe leak.
Please post up advice. I am going to start by getting the head re torqued along with the cam,
Reassembly: I got new valves but the shims did not come close to spec so we nicked them down a few tenths of a mm on the exhaust. They were too tight even with small shims. Ended up taking .20 off the valve and going with 192.5 shims as per factory.
Clearence was .16 intake and .35 and .36 on the exaust. They had been lapped in the day before.
head was taken home and torqued using a scale instead of a proper wrench. by the time conversion was done head bolts were at 10kg and the cams at 8kg. which should be ok as they felt ok.
Engine was set to tdc after the combustion stroke of the rear. rear intake cam pointing up at front tdc.
TIming was set with the exaust cam in the front slightly canted counter clockwise about half a tooth. but making a straight line on the cam gears.
Manual cct was made using a tap and a bolt into the auto housing retaining the stock foot.
several spins were made with a wrench to make sure the valves would not crash. Compression felt weak but I figured that it was due to the head being a bit dry and valves being new.
I hit the starter and all felt fine and sounded good. but front sounds quiet.
I test fired and the front seemed loud.
Reassembled it put fuel in and front is making valve noise. Not a scream and not a loosening cct but almost like a pipe leak.
Please post up advice. I am going to start by getting the head re torqued along with the cam,
11-06-2016, 04:41 PM
#2
Rex Kramer-Thrill Seeker
SuperBike
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Brookfield, WI
Posts: 2,312
*READ THIS GUIDE SOBER*
www.vtr1000.org ? View topic - Manual Cam Chain Tensioner Installation Guide (MCCT's)
You even posted in it. Follow the guide. It is very simple. DO NOT try and skip steps to save time. Make sure your engine is timed correctly and there is proper slack on the timing chains.
Could you explain what you mean by using a scale, instead of a proper torque wrench? You say they "felt" okay. Do you mean you torqued everything down by feel?
www.vtr1000.org ? View topic - Manual Cam Chain Tensioner Installation Guide (MCCT's)
You even posted in it. Follow the guide. It is very simple. DO NOT try and skip steps to save time. Make sure your engine is timed correctly and there is proper slack on the timing chains.
Could you explain what you mean by using a scale, instead of a proper torque wrench? You say they "felt" okay. Do you mean you torqued everything down by feel?
Last edited by CruxGNZ; 11-06-2016 at 04:45 PM.
11-06-2016, 05:53 PM
#3
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 345
If The car shop cant loan me a torque wrench I am up the creek without a bike.
I used a literal scale at 1 foot on the wrench. Read it online. IT may be a total crock but I was desperate. I mean after I got the bolts torqued using a literal scale on the wrench I felt them and It seemed about what 25 should feel like. I am not a fan at all of doing it like that. It isnt smart. Ill read the guide one more time. I was sober when I did all of this. But to be honest freezing my **** off tired wasnt great. I dont pound brews regularly just when My valves bend the day after engine checks.
Looking for a wrench now. Going to have my wife call around. If I strap the bike in the truck and bring it to the shop they will sort me out. Thing is I dont like how it sits in the k truck aka a micromachine of a truck. I thought it was going to fall out. So that is the real reason its not at the bike shop. Dont want it to fall out. I was going to drive it up for a re torque and check.
Again not happy with how the head went. I am not comfy with doing my own lap in as it was my first time. I am also not cool with re using gaskets and bolts especially without a proper wrench. But I am sure I missed a step in the timing process or that cct is over tight. More betting on the first than the later. Ill re read. the only thing that has me un sure is the cam posistion when the front is on proper tdc. Is it one cam up and one in for the rear or is that tdc for the rear and the front is 1 and a 1/4 turn more. If its 1 and 1/4 turn then I am out 1 turn.
I used a literal scale at 1 foot on the wrench. Read it online. IT may be a total crock but I was desperate. I mean after I got the bolts torqued using a literal scale on the wrench I felt them and It seemed about what 25 should feel like. I am not a fan at all of doing it like that. It isnt smart. Ill read the guide one more time. I was sober when I did all of this. But to be honest freezing my **** off tired wasnt great. I dont pound brews regularly just when My valves bend the day after engine checks.
Looking for a wrench now. Going to have my wife call around. If I strap the bike in the truck and bring it to the shop they will sort me out. Thing is I dont like how it sits in the k truck aka a micromachine of a truck. I thought it was going to fall out. So that is the real reason its not at the bike shop. Dont want it to fall out. I was going to drive it up for a re torque and check.
Again not happy with how the head went. I am not comfy with doing my own lap in as it was my first time. I am also not cool with re using gaskets and bolts especially without a proper wrench. But I am sure I missed a step in the timing process or that cct is over tight. More betting on the first than the later. Ill re read. the only thing that has me un sure is the cam posistion when the front is on proper tdc. Is it one cam up and one in for the rear or is that tdc for the rear and the front is 1 and a 1/4 turn more. If its 1 and 1/4 turn then I am out 1 turn.
11-06-2016, 06:02 PM
#6
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11-06-2016, 08:31 PM
#8
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Posts: 345
Its on or going on a container ship right now along with about 1000 specialty metric tools I use for my car engines but bike engines are really neat so I think I am going to build a few.
Going right now to borrow one. I just need to re check the cam bolt spec I know the heads are 35nm.
Love dr evil and I could hear it in my head as I read the meme
Going right now to borrow one. I just need to re check the cam bolt spec I know the heads are 35nm.
Love dr evil and I could hear it in my head as I read the meme
11-07-2016, 12:20 AM
#9
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Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 345
E.marquez thanks!!
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...-torque-23284/
It runs strong I mean real strong and quiet except a small exaust leak in the rear link. I blew it off testing and shoved it back on ruining the packing.
I am suspicious that I may be 180 out. at it runs mean. I had nowhere to test top end but I did let her free rev to 7500. I know its not good ( Not good as in terrible for the motor.) but wanted to see. I got a slight fart ocassionally at 3k. Ill check other posts about that. It could be many many things.
I still need to cable wrap everything install my new flasher find my last new winker as it went missing.
also lost two fender bolts have three extra washers probably exaust for two of them and one extra bolt. the extra bolt frightens me but I would bet its a fender support as both of them are still off.
Also I dunno if I said this but when I checked with my torque wrench she was super close to spec .01 kilo on a dial. so you can use a kitchen scale in an emergency. I need to ride to work tomorrow so its all good!!!
Thanks again all any new guys like me reading this dont follow what I did use carls guide on vtr1000.org he covers lots of stuff.
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...-torque-23284/
It runs strong I mean real strong and quiet except a small exaust leak in the rear link. I blew it off testing and shoved it back on ruining the packing.
I am suspicious that I may be 180 out. at it runs mean. I had nowhere to test top end but I did let her free rev to 7500. I know its not good ( Not good as in terrible for the motor.) but wanted to see. I got a slight fart ocassionally at 3k. Ill check other posts about that. It could be many many things.
I still need to cable wrap everything install my new flasher find my last new winker as it went missing.
also lost two fender bolts have three extra washers probably exaust for two of them and one extra bolt. the extra bolt frightens me but I would bet its a fender support as both of them are still off.
Also I dunno if I said this but when I checked with my torque wrench she was super close to spec .01 kilo on a dial. so you can use a kitchen scale in an emergency. I need to ride to work tomorrow so its all good!!!
Thanks again all any new guys like me reading this dont follow what I did use carls guide on vtr1000.org he covers lots of stuff.
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