Bit of help please from the technical minded, not SH
10-26-2014, 11:20 PM
#1
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Bit of help please from the technical minded, not SH
Im having to make something for my partners bike. She had an accident over two years ago on another bike. Her injuries were numerous. But now she is back walking and thinking of the odd track day I need to come up with a way to get her to be able to change gear without the use of her left foot. Her ankle had to be fused.
We cant afford a quickshifter. The bike is a GT650 Hyosung.
So my current idea is the below. I would like others to look at the idea and tell me what they think.
On the left grip I will mount a throttle control, twin cable. I will cut the tube down to 1/4 length and take up the rest with a normal grip. Then run 2 cables down to the front sprocket cover. I will make a mount for the bales to go into. then I will get the splined shift piece that goes onto the selection input shaft welded with mount for the other end of the cables.
So a twist forward of the grip does a down shift and back does an upshift.
Like a bicycle gear shifter.
Please tell me if you think this is stupid? I realize there will be some fine tuning needed for leverage ratios.
But in my head this works.
We cant afford a quickshifter. The bike is a GT650 Hyosung.
So my current idea is the below. I would like others to look at the idea and tell me what they think.
On the left grip I will mount a throttle control, twin cable. I will cut the tube down to 1/4 length and take up the rest with a normal grip. Then run 2 cables down to the front sprocket cover. I will make a mount for the bales to go into. then I will get the splined shift piece that goes onto the selection input shaft welded with mount for the other end of the cables.
So a twist forward of the grip does a down shift and back does an upshift.
Like a bicycle gear shifter.
Please tell me if you think this is stupid? I realize there will be some fine tuning needed for leverage ratios.
But in my head this works.
10-27-2014, 12:59 AM
#2
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You my want to contact Hyosong and see if they have a right side shifter setup. These days it's not likely but was very common in the 60's,70's and 80's, especially if they had a dirt tract model. Never hurts to ask and explain your problem.
10-27-2014, 06:35 AM
#4
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Still might be doable. We use the brake and throttle at the same time. An on mountain bikes the brake and grip shift. I wouldn't want to on the strong throw of the superhawk for very long I wouldn't think
10-27-2014, 06:42 AM
#5
Well take off, eh.
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10-27-2014, 07:00 AM
#6
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Personaly i would go a little different route. i would fabricate a lever to go back behind the foot peg that would take care of up shifting and the one in the front would take care of downshifting. this way its much less complicated and you could fab that part easy and just weld it to the back of the shifter thats already there and just curve it around the foot peg.
10-27-2014, 11:07 AM
#8
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Maybe a stupid idea, but what about a jockey shift? it would slow her down some, but its just a trackday and not racing. I run an SV650 which is power curve wise about the same bike. I don't know what tracks you run and how big they are but I run little talledega Gran Prix which is a bull ring, I have problems with my hip and my ankles so bad that I have to physically grab my boots with my hand to get them on the right spot on the pegs so I try to shift as little as possible. I generally get it into 4th or 5th gear and just ride my ride and leave it in that gear the whole session unless something happens on track that requires me to shift for some reason. I get blown away in the small straight sections but get in and out of the corners nicely and even if I lug that little twin down to 3k rpm's it will pull itself back out of it rather nicely.
You just have to be careful not to slam it open on corner exit because it will break the tire loose if you jerk it too hard (of course I wasn't quite to the corner exit when I slammed it open in my mishap either, kept it upright, but had a small pucker moment)
oh, and I've looked into the electronic shifters as well. I run an R/C business and have thought about making one of my own.. $700-1200 seems ridiculous to me for what it is. I've got $100 1/8th scale servo's that would do the job.. 400 oz/in of torque and move 45 degrees of rotation in .08 seconds. I just don't know how to go about rigging up a controller for it, I never got into that technical side with robotics and such
You just have to be careful not to slam it open on corner exit because it will break the tire loose if you jerk it too hard (of course I wasn't quite to the corner exit when I slammed it open in my mishap either, kept it upright, but had a small pucker moment)
oh, and I've looked into the electronic shifters as well. I run an R/C business and have thought about making one of my own.. $700-1200 seems ridiculous to me for what it is. I've got $100 1/8th scale servo's that would do the job.. 400 oz/in of torque and move 45 degrees of rotation in .08 seconds. I just don't know how to go about rigging up a controller for it, I never got into that technical side with robotics and such
Last edited by insulinboy; 10-27-2014 at 11:15 AM.
10-27-2014, 11:14 AM
#9
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Personaly i would go a little different route. i would fabricate a lever to go back behind the foot peg that would take care of up shifting and the one in the front would take care of downshifting. this way its much less complicated and you could fab that part easy and just weld it to the back of the shifter thats already there and just curve it around the foot peg.
10-27-2014, 11:15 AM
#10
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10-27-2014, 03:58 PM
#11
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What about fabbing up your own electronic shifter using 12 volt door poppers? Kits on eBay are around 75.00 including solenoids, maybe use 1 for upshift and 1 for down. You could probably make up a remote mount for the solenoids and then use cables on those instead of a left side throttle tube, just use a couple of small buttons to actuate them.
10-27-2014, 05:22 PM
#12
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What about fabbing up your own electronic shifter using 12 volt door poppers? Kits on eBay are around 75.00 including solenoids, maybe use 1 for upshift and 1 for down. You could probably make up a remote mount for the solenoids and then use cables on those instead of a left side throttle tube, just use a couple of small buttons to actuate them.
10-27-2014, 06:51 PM
#14
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That worked off air pressure, 7. A person would look like a real idiot walking around with a 12VDC captive bolt pistol. Next, joe is going to be on a quest for the right lithium battery to run it. Can't have your captive bolt pistol die on you when you least expect it. "Hey buddy, can I get a jump for my captive bolt pistol?" Then everyone will start modding it. Here comes mikstr with the carbon and titanium - gotta get that bolt speed up. There's kenmoore polishing ever little bit and covering it with mesh. How you gonna get brain matter out of that mesh, kenmoore? You know the factory return spring is gonna be too soft. The end-all, be-all mod is gonna be some kind of inside-out bolt swap. But, which inside-out bolt is the best? See what you've started, 7?
Last edited by VTR1000F; 10-28-2014 at 06:07 AM.
10-27-2014, 07:34 PM
#15
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Mr.Spokes Your thinking is along the same lines as Vespa scooters used back in the early sixties. They made the whole clutch lever assembly a rotating gear selector. Though this would probably not be practical in this situation. The servo shifting setup might be a little less complicated but likely more expensive. You know your budget and mechanical skills, so, the cable setup as you pointed out has the leverage/ratio to deal with, but that can be worked out.
The Dragons Tail runs through my backyard
The Dragons Tail runs through my backyard
10-27-2014, 07:44 PM
#16
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I didn't think of that and I've got one of those old Vespa Scooters in the garage.. and you don't know scary till you've done a wheelie on one of those 200cc missiles and then run it all the way up to 70mph in 4th gear. I thought it was going to fall apart between my legs
Edited to add
Here is the tube all ready for a clutch lever and cables for the shifting mechanism. Maybe you can mod it to fit on the SV's bars?
http://www.scooterwest.com/items/?_p...E-VSX-VNX/5880
If you give me a couple of days I will see about taking the one in the garage apart enough to measure where it mounts to the handlebars and see if it mounts to a 7/8" bar or if its bigger or smaller. The whole Grip and Clutch lever rotates and everything.. its kind of wierd lol
Last edited by insulinboy; 10-27-2014 at 07:49 PM.
10-27-2014, 09:10 PM
#17
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Thanks for the ideas guys. This is not an easy fix but happy to be doing it as the outcome could have been a lot worse from this crash.
Clutch and gear lever moves? that is odd. I did think of a moving clutch lever, down for a downshift and up for up.
Clutch and gear lever moves? that is odd. I did think of a moving clutch lever, down for a downshift and up for up.
10-27-2014, 09:15 PM
#18
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Not sure what your budget is for fabing up a working solution ..
but $215 gets you a off the shelf solution to your issue
Holeshot Powershifter 2
but $215 gets you a off the shelf solution to your issue
Holeshot Powershifter 2
10-27-2014, 09:23 PM
#19
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Not sure what your budget is for fabing up a working solution ..
but $215 gets you a off the shelf solution to your issue
Holeshot Powershifter 2
but $215 gets you a off the shelf solution to your issue
Holeshot Powershifter 2
10-28-2014, 01:29 AM
#20
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Beaten to it as I just read this.
When I was 10 we had a Vespa scooter on the farm and it had the clutch and gear change via cables all on the left handle bar.
I can't see why this wouldn't work .
A lot of fabbing I know.
The scooter would of been a 50's or 60's model but it worked and did the job until we blew it up and guess what! We bought a Honda Ag bike, or rather a cub 50 with everything taken off and a home made rack on the front and back.
Try as I might I couldn't break it.
Let us know how you go and it's great that the girl wants to get back on a bike as well.
When I was 10 we had a Vespa scooter on the farm and it had the clutch and gear change via cables all on the left handle bar.
I can't see why this wouldn't work .
A lot of fabbing I know.
The scooter would of been a 50's or 60's model but it worked and did the job until we blew it up and guess what! We bought a Honda Ag bike, or rather a cub 50 with everything taken off and a home made rack on the front and back.
Try as I might I couldn't break it.
Let us know how you go and it's great that the girl wants to get back on a bike as well.
10-28-2014, 05:36 AM
#21
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Im working on a bike build concept for a triple amputee......someone having no ability to rotate either ankle under control. We are looking to push button controlled shifting though....with a Pingel shiftier and a Auto clutch ... and that's pricey unfortunately.
Good luck with your build.. very cool of you to make the effort.
10-28-2014, 06:05 AM
#22
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Instead of twist grip actuated cables, what about thumb levers on each grip for up-shift, down-shift. Kind of like a snowmobile throttle. I'm thinking up-shift on the right so you can combine a throttle-off move with grabbing the next gear with the thumb.
Or, how about a dual lever set-up of some kind on the left, clutch plus shift. Clutch lever pulls first and a further pull also grabs the shift. You would need a mechanism of some sort to switch the shift lever between up and down shifts.
Or, how about a dual lever set-up of some kind on the left, clutch plus shift. Clutch lever pulls first and a further pull also grabs the shift. You would need a mechanism of some sort to switch the shift lever between up and down shifts.
10-28-2014, 08:00 AM
#23
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This was discussed in the original post as one of the options he couldn't afford. Those systems cost upwards of $1200 for the better ones and $700-800 for the cheap ones
10-28-2014, 08:08 AM
#24
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<<<@!1!@>>>
Here is how it works on the vespa, the cables operate more like how a bicycle gear shift works, but theres no reason why you couldn't have it return to center after the shift and ratchet for the gear changes I would think.
Like I said I haven't torn it apart to look at it but I will try and find some time in the next week or two to investigate further and see if it could be a viable solution to your problem. If it is the only thing you will end up having to fab is a bracket to hold the cables in front of the shift rod, and cut up a shift lever to mount some cable attachments too. Then find a company that will make you some custom cables (they are out there because you have to get custom throttle, clutch, and brake cables for a lot of the older bikes now. I had to get a set of throttle cables made years ago for my RD125 because the part wasn't available through Yamaha at the time)
Here is how it works on the vespa, the cables operate more like how a bicycle gear shift works, but theres no reason why you couldn't have it return to center after the shift and ratchet for the gear changes I would think.
Like I said I haven't torn it apart to look at it but I will try and find some time in the next week or two to investigate further and see if it could be a viable solution to your problem. If it is the only thing you will end up having to fab is a bracket to hold the cables in front of the shift rod, and cut up a shift lever to mount some cable attachments too. Then find a company that will make you some custom cables (they are out there because you have to get custom throttle, clutch, and brake cables for a lot of the older bikes now. I had to get a set of throttle cables made years ago for my RD125 because the part wasn't available through Yamaha at the time)
10-28-2014, 08:38 AM
#25
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He said he couldn't afford a quickshifter. Designing some type of thumb actuated shift levers intead of a twist grip shift actuator does not a purchased quickshifter make.
10-28-2014, 09:55 AM
#26
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Right Foot?
How about the right foot, I would think that it would be a lot easier to make a linkage and a shaft across the bottom of the engine and put a shifter on the right side of the bike.
10-28-2014, 10:26 AM
#27
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<<<@!1!@>>>
Here is how it works on the vespa, the cables operate more like how a bicycle gear shift works, but theres no reason why you couldn't have it return to center after the shift and ratchet for the gear changes I would think.
Like I said I haven't torn it apart to look at it but I will try and find some time in the next week or two to investigate further and see if it could be a viable solution to your problem. If it is the only thing you will end up having to fab is a bracket to hold the cables in front of the shift rod, and cut up a shift lever to mount some cable attachments too. Then find a company that will make you some custom cables (they are out there because you have to get custom throttle, clutch, and brake cables for a lot of the older bikes now. I had to get a set of throttle cables made years ago for my RD125 because the part wasn't available through Yamaha at the time)
Here is how it works on the vespa, the cables operate more like how a bicycle gear shift works, but theres no reason why you couldn't have it return to center after the shift and ratchet for the gear changes I would think.
Like I said I haven't torn it apart to look at it but I will try and find some time in the next week or two to investigate further and see if it could be a viable solution to your problem. If it is the only thing you will end up having to fab is a bracket to hold the cables in front of the shift rod, and cut up a shift lever to mount some cable attachments too. Then find a company that will make you some custom cables (they are out there because you have to get custom throttle, clutch, and brake cables for a lot of the older bikes now. I had to get a set of throttle cables made years ago for my RD125 because the part wasn't available through Yamaha at the time)
That pretty much what Im doing without the clutch lever moving. Thanks for that.
Making all the cable fittings for me is easy. Im a Bicycle mechanic by trade and now work in the tech side of that giving advice to mechanics. Making cable fittings is what we do all the time.
Last edited by NZSpokes; 10-28-2014 at 10:32 AM.
10-28-2014, 10:29 AM
#28
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Yes , but takes very little foot movement.. a twitch is all.... assuming your partner can lift or step with the left foot it should work..... no need to rotate the foot really.Just another idea...
Im working on a bike build concept for a triple amputee......someone having no ability to rotate either ankle under control. We are looking to push button controlled shifting though....with a Pingel shiftier and a Auto clutch ... and that's pricey unfortunately.
Good luck with your build.. very cool of you to make the effort.
Im working on a bike build concept for a triple amputee......someone having no ability to rotate either ankle under control. We are looking to push button controlled shifting though....with a Pingel shiftier and a Auto clutch ... and that's pricey unfortunately.
Good luck with your build.. very cool of you to make the effort.
But it also means no pain. Trust me after watching her in pain for 2 years this is a blessing. Least I can do is make this so she can ride.
10-28-2014, 11:16 AM
#29
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That shifter is NORMALLY activated by a small movement of the foot. But like ALL shifters.. you can lift the entire foot (flexing at the knee) to move the shift lever, or step down on the shifter to activate as well.. There is no need to rotate the foot at the ankle.
I teach this all the time in my class for some smallish riders on certain bikes that they simply can not move the shifter though is required full travel to get another gear.
In any case, it seems like your looking for almost no cost home built from available materials on hand..any electric shifter install is going to cost more then that.
Sorry to waste your time.. good luck with the build..Look forward to seeing it in actin with a great big grin on her face.
Last edited by E.Marquez; 10-28-2014 at 11:35 AM.
10-28-2014, 12:21 PM
#30
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Got ya.. perhaps i was too wordy in my response....
That shifter is NORMALLY activated by a small movement of the foot. But like ALL shifters.. you can lift the entire foot (flexing at the knee) to move the shift lever, or step down on the shifter to activate as well.. There is no need to rotate the foot at the ankle.
I teach this all the time in my class for some smallish riders on certain bikes that they simply can not move the shifter though is required full travel to get another gear.
In any case, it seems like your looking for almost no cost home built from available materials on hand..any electric shifter install is going to cost more then that.
Sorry to waste your time.. good luck with the build..Look forward to seeing it in actin with a great big grin on her face.
That shifter is NORMALLY activated by a small movement of the foot. But like ALL shifters.. you can lift the entire foot (flexing at the knee) to move the shift lever, or step down on the shifter to activate as well.. There is no need to rotate the foot at the ankle.
I teach this all the time in my class for some smallish riders on certain bikes that they simply can not move the shifter though is required full travel to get another gear.
In any case, it seems like your looking for almost no cost home built from available materials on hand..any electric shifter install is going to cost more then that.
Sorry to waste your time.. good luck with the build..Look forward to seeing it in actin with a great big grin on her face.
2 and a bit years with only one income has not been easy. She is looking for work now she can walk so things will free up.
